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The Old Firm

By ediniedepopo - 24-04-2011 01:54

Well hello there! Some might remember me as celticvilla, I'm back, but I've moved country! It's been over a year I've left the family, but I've come back! I was the guy who made loads of spelling mistakes and the weird flag next to his name? Nope? Oh well, love you too. So here it goes... The Old Firm, I would predominantly like to know your thoughts and views of the game. Do you think it should be played behind closed doors? Do you support one of the old firm? Do you regularly watch the game? I'd like to see English people commenting on it and seeing their reasons for supporting one and not the other. Or if it doesn't bother you say so. I'm doing a report, and I'd love for a few to help with some questions if you have any type of view. Even if it is, "The old what?". Thank you in advance! (No bigotry or sectarian comments please! I'm begging you that you keep this on the guidelines that you have agreed to so I can get this report done!) Happy Easter! (:Well hello there! Some might remember me as celticvilla, I'm back, but I've moved country! It's been over a year I've left the family, but I've come back! I was the guy who made loads of spelling mistakes and the weird flag next to his name? Nope? Oh well, love you too.
So here it goes...
The Old Firm, I would predominantly like to know your thoughts and views of the game. Do you think it should be played behind closed doors? Do you support one of the old firm? Do you regularly watch the game? I'd like to see English people commenting on it and seeing their reasons for supporting one and not the other. Or if it doesn't bother you say so. I'm doing a report, and I'd love for a few to help with some questions if you have any type of view. Even if it is, "The old what?". Thank you in advance! (No bigotry or sectarian comments please! I'm begging you that you keep this on the guidelines that you have agreed to so I can get this report done!) Happy Easter! (:

 

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Re: The Old Firm

By heddo - 24-04-2011 05:31

after the arrests inside the ground and the fact that the last game lead to a parlaimentary debate, in a normal circumstance would this game see more policing and a more subdued atmosphere, what i find shocking is the fact that the media try to stoke the fire and maybe more shocking they dont realise that this is what they are doing and maybe the authorities too by adding comment and almost sexing up the pre match hype, its a derby game and there are lots of em around the country, but dont talk to me about any of the other stuff linked to it and dont tell me its different to any other derby game cause all the other stuff added to it is a load of old bollocks..after the arrests inside the ground and the fact that the last game lead to a parlaimentary debate, in a normal circumstance would this game see more policing and a more subdued atmosphere, what i find shocking is the fact that the media try to stoke the fire and maybe more shocking they dont realise that this is what they are doing and maybe the authorities too by adding comment and almost sexing up the pre match hype, its a derby game and there are lots of em around the country, but dont talk to me about any of the other stuff linked to it and dont tell me its different to any other derby game cause all the other stuff added to it is a load of old bollocks..

Re: The Old Firm

By matttombstone - 24-04-2011 05:48

[BotP]

No Derby game is bigger than Sunderland Vs Newcastle, simples. Welcome back btw Celticvilla, I remember you well, if I remember correctly wasn't the flag a Macedonia one?No Derby game is bigger than Sunderland Vs Newcastle, simples.

Welcome back btw Celticvilla, I remember you well, if I remember correctly wasn't the flag a Macedonia one?

Re: The Old Firm

By ediniedepopo - 24-04-2011 11:36

No, it was the Emerati one, thank you! It's changed quite a bit since I left! For the better, sim improved?No, it was the Emerati one, thank you! It's changed quite a bit since I left! For the better, sim improved?

Re: The Old Firm

By alx460 - 24-04-2011 12:14

My dad's an irish glasgow man so I grew up with an affinity to Celtic. I dont call myself a supporter, but I do root for them. I think without the old firm rivalry, the SPL would be like any other domestic league in a small european country. The atmosphere at the old firm games are incredible, to suggest they be played behind closed doors is ridiculous, especially considering Rangers players and fans seem to largely be the antogonists recently. Celtic fans have been relatively well behaved. To have it going to partliament is also stupid, its a rivalry, its not pretty but you shouldnt try to wrap it in cotton wool and make it family friendly. Its a necessary evil i sayMy dad's an irish glasgow man so I grew up with an affinity to Celtic. I dont call myself a supporter, but I do root for them. I think without the old firm rivalry, the SPL would be like any other domestic league in a small european country. The atmosphere at the old firm games are incredible, to suggest they be played behind closed doors is ridiculous, especially considering Rangers players and fans seem to largely be the antogonists recently. Celtic fans have been relatively well behaved.
To have it going to partliament is also stupid, its a rivalry, its not pretty but you shouldnt try to wrap it in cotton wool and make it family friendly. Its a necessary evil i say

Re: The Old Firm

By alx460 - 24-04-2011 12:16

P.S - obviously a necessary evil to point of fierce rivalry in the footballing sense. The violence and letter bombs is pretty unsavory and shameful.P.S - obviously a necessary evil to point of fierce rivalry in the footballing sense. The violence and letter bombs is pretty unsavory and shameful.

Re: The Old Firm

By deleted_2773482 - 24-04-2011 21:35

Well for what it's worth here's my opinion.......as an English born, half Scot, living in Scotland. Bigotry and Racism are 2 of the worst ''cancers'' that effect our society. They are especially prevailant in Northern Ireland and Glasgow. We all know the history of why this scenario has mainfested. But what is beyond me is how it keeps going on and on and on..... We are in the year 2011.....yet a battle fought in 1690 still has a major bearing on life of a vast swathe of the population in the afforementioned places. How can this be ? Most people who live in the UK outwith these areas I would say look on increulously....I know I do...at how such hatred can still exist so many years down the line. I can only put this down to bad leadership and a people who have an unforgiving, deeply bigoted attitude towards others. It's a disgrace....and it deeply shames Scotland in the eyes of Europe and indeed the world. Anyone who has endured racist or bigoted comments ( I have )......and felt that deep rooted, stomach churning....indeed sickening feeling inside as either your nation or religion is insulted or pulled to pieces will know what racism or bigotry does, and how it destroys communities. As for the Old Firm......well here is what I'd do if I was the SFA. Some say it is not the football clubs fault......well to a certain degree that is true......but unfortunately this society problem has manifested itself into the football rivalry. When you have Rats in the basement.....it isn't your fault......but you don't want to live with them do you ? 1. SFA should give Celtic and Rangers 1 year to completely irradicate sectarianism from their clubs. 2. If they fail they are given the following choice. A) Banishment for good from the Scottish game. or B) Amalgamate as a combined, united Glasgow team. Catholic and Protestant .....Blue and green. The above should be non negotiable. Then sit back and watch Celtic and Rangers REALLY sort out the problem instead of just hot air and false promises.Well for what it's worth here's my opinion.......as an English born, half Scot, living in Scotland.

Bigotry and Racism are 2 of the worst ''cancers'' that effect our society. They are especially prevailant in Northern Ireland and Glasgow. We all know the history of why this scenario has mainfested. But what is beyond me is how it keeps going on and on and on.....

We are in the year 2011.....yet a battle fought in 1690 still has a major bearing on life of a vast swathe of the population in the afforementioned places. How can this be ? Most people who live in the UK outwith these areas I would say look on increulously....I know I do...at how such hatred can still exist so many years down the line.

I can only put this down to bad leadership and a people who have an unforgiving, deeply bigoted attitude towards others. It's a disgrace....and it deeply shames Scotland in the eyes of Europe and indeed the world.

Anyone who has endured racist or bigoted comments ( I have )......and felt that deep rooted, stomach churning....indeed sickening feeling inside as either your nation or religion is insulted or pulled to pieces will know what racism or bigotry does, and how it destroys communities.

As for the Old Firm......well here is what I'd do if I was the SFA.

Some say it is not the football clubs fault......well to a certain degree that is true......but unfortunately this society problem has manifested itself into the football rivalry. When you have Rats in the basement.....it isn't your fault......but you don't want to live with them do you ?

1. SFA should give Celtic and Rangers 1 year to completely irradicate sectarianism from their clubs.

2. If they fail they are given the following choice.

A) Banishment for good from the Scottish game.

or

B) Amalgamate as a combined, united Glasgow team. Catholic and Protestant .....Blue and green.

The above should be non negotiable.

Then sit back and watch Celtic and Rangers REALLY sort out the problem instead of just hot air and false promises.

Re: The Old Firm

By matttombstone - 24-04-2011 21:39

[BotP]

Ah, my bad =P If it's been about a year, I don't think a lot has changed, can't really recall but I think that the biggest change was the layout, don't think that's quite been a year yet. Other changes, perhaps the inclusion of 3 extra tactic slots and the availablilty section in tactics, again these are club member only options. One big change is Patrick777 is now CEO of managerzone and Cattleyard has gone. No changes to the sim or 3D however, but Hockey 3D is now more widely available to those who couldn't view it before. Nothing else I can recall.Ah, my bad =P If it's been about a year, I don't think a lot has changed, can't really recall but I think that the biggest change was the layout, don't think that's quite been a year yet. Other changes, perhaps the inclusion of 3 extra tactic slots and the availablilty section in tactics, again these are club member only options. One big change is Patrick777 is now CEO of managerzone and Cattleyard has gone. No changes to the sim or 3D however, but Hockey 3D is now more widely available to those who couldn't view it before. Nothing else I can recall.

Re: The Old Firm

By alx460 - 24-04-2011 22:26

I agree with what whins is saying, but I look at it as more matter-of-fact. Its not pretty, but it is what it is. You cant tell me there isnt a football rivalry between England and Germany rooted in a certain unpleasant war 70 years ago. Old firm isnt pleasant, and attitudes to race and religion need to change, but there is only so much meddling authorities can do to change the fans as a whole. The ferocity in the old firm is core to scottish domestic football, you cant eradicate the knowledge in peoples minds of WHY they have that ferocious rivalry. Sure you can stop the songs and stop the violence, which I support, but beyond that its about becomes a matter of soceity and social attitudes in Glasgow, not a responsibility for football teams so long as there is no encouragement.Football clubs arent social influencers like media or politics.I agree with what whins is saying, but I look at it as more matter-of-fact. Its not pretty, but it is what it is. You cant tell me there isnt a football rivalry between England and Germany rooted in a certain unpleasant war 70 years ago.

Old firm isnt pleasant, and attitudes to race and religion need to change, but there is only so much meddling authorities can do to change the fans as a whole. The ferocity in the old firm is core to scottish domestic football, you cant eradicate the knowledge in peoples minds of WHY they have that ferocious rivalry. Sure you can stop the songs and stop the violence, which I support, but beyond that its about becomes a matter of soceity and social attitudes in Glasgow, not a responsibility for football teams so long as there is no encouragement.Football clubs arent social influencers like media or politics.

Re: The Old Firm

By deleted_2773482 - 25-04-2011 01:02

''The ferocity in the old firm is core to scottish domestic football'' I could not disagree more Alex. It is the ''core reason'' of that ferocity that makes Scottish football the leper that it is. I can promise you that if the Scottish Government or SFA carried out my affore mentioned ultimatum we would see a radical change in behaviour........with or without Rangers and Celtic. Someone in Scottish football or governmental authority needs to find some balls.''The ferocity in the old firm is core to scottish domestic football''

I could not disagree more Alex.

It is the ''core reason'' of that ferocity that makes Scottish football the leper that it is.

I can promise you that if the Scottish Government or SFA carried out my affore mentioned ultimatum we would see a radical change in behaviour........with or without Rangers and Celtic.

Someone in Scottish football or governmental authority needs to find some balls.

Re: The Old Firm

By alx460 - 25-04-2011 11:12

My concern is that id rather have 100,000 angry young men in a stadium letting out their agression by shouting and screaming (sectarianism to one side for the moment) , than 100,000 angry young men roaming the streets of glasgow. Lets not forget that glasgow is the most poverty stricken place in the UK, those teams represent the most important thing in alot of people's lives up there. If someone tries to take that away from them you'll have full scale riots on your hands. Dangerous game meddling in football on the scale you're suggesting whins.My concern is that id rather have 100,000 angry young men in a stadium letting out their agression by shouting and screaming (sectarianism to one side for the moment) , than 100,000 angry young men roaming the streets of glasgow. Lets not forget that glasgow is the most poverty stricken place in the UK, those teams represent the most important thing in alot of people's lives up there. If someone tries to take that away from them you'll have full scale riots on your hands.
Dangerous game meddling in football on the scale you're suggesting whins.

Re: The Old Firm

By deleted_2773482 - 26-04-2011 07:22

Your right Alex.....it would cause great consternation and would probably lead to violence. But if the authorities do nothing (which they are marvellously adapt at) we will continue like this forever. Much of the current discontent within the country is down to people in power in all walks of life not doing.......and just talking. Sometimes draconian measures are the only way to really sort a problem. Just my opinion of course;) .........I will say so......at 43 years of age and after following current affairs keenly most of my adult life......I am so tired of seeing ''self obsessed actors'' filling roles within authority (politics, Sport etc) who talk the talk......but never actually walk the walk. In Glasgow....when it comes to football......someone needs to grab the Bulls horns.Your right Alex.....it would cause great consternation and would probably lead to violence. But if the authorities do nothing (which they are marvellously adapt at) we will continue like this forever.

Much of the current discontent within the country is down to people in power in all walks of life not doing.......and just talking.

Sometimes draconian measures are the only way to really sort a problem.

Just my opinion of course;) .........I will say so......at 43 years of age and after following current affairs keenly most of my adult life......I am so tired of seeing ''self obsessed actors'' filling roles within authority (politics, Sport etc)
who talk the talk......but never actually walk the walk.

In Glasgow....when it comes to football......someone needs to grab the Bulls horns.

 

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