Football » English » Suggestions/Improvements

Training efficiency

By kin_gls2 - 08-07-2021 12:06

[MM]

I would like to see the regular training displayed the same way as the Training Camp report is being displayed. Instead of heaving those circles - which are quite confusing - I would like to see a training efficiency percentage. For example a youth player of mine has trained in TC for 2 days with an efficienty of 7 lines in the circle, when I go to see the TC overview I see 38% one day and 48% the other day. That is a HUGE difference you would not notice if it wasn't for that TC report.I would like to see the regular training displayed the same way as the Training Camp report is being displayed. Instead of heaving those circles - which are quite confusing - I would like to see a training efficiency percentage.

For example a youth player of mine has trained in TC for 2 days with an efficienty of 7 lines in the circle, when I go to see the TC overview I see 38% one day and 48% the other day. That is a HUGE difference you would not notice if it wasn't for that TC report.

 

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Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 08-07-2021 20:25

[-FO-]

+1+1

Re: Training efficiency

By franella82 - 12-07-2021 16:24

[CBA-MZ]

+1+1

Odg.: Training efficiency

By elgoranian (LA) (NCA) - 14-07-2021 15:12

[Ex Yu]

+1+1

Re: Training efficiency

By mayunga - 26-07-2021 16:06

[World]

It's funny because I was literally gonna write this exact post today and I've just seen this! [b]+1[/b]

kin_gls2 wrote:

I would like to see the regular training displayed the same way as the Training Camp report is being displayed. Instead of heaving those circles - which are quite confusing - I would like to see a training efficiency percentage.

For example a youth player of mine has trained in TC for 2 days with an efficienty of 7 lines in the circle, when I go to see the TC overview I see 38% one day and 48% the other day. That is a HUGE difference you would not notice if it wasn't for that TC report.

It's funny because I was literally gonna write this exact post today and I've just seen this!

+1

Re: Training efficiency

By viedras20 - 27-07-2021 11:02

[LT-Cm]

On the other hand, no real-life manager has a specific percentage of how his players train - imagine being a manager and after every training session, you get an exact value of how much player X improved his speed or shooting accuracy. So I think it's reasonable that we only see a visual approximation of training efficiency, rather than absolute values.On the other hand, no real-life manager has a specific percentage of how his players train - imagine being a manager and after every training session, you get an exact value of how much player X improved his speed or shooting accuracy. So I think it's reasonable that we only see a visual approximation of training efficiency, rather than absolute values.

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 27-07-2021 15:58

[-FO-]

Are you sure about that? Are you telling us that in RL coaches don't know the physical parameters of their players? Guess again. :))

viedras20 wrote:

On the other hand, no real-life manager has a specific percentage of how his players train - imagine being a manager and after every training session, you get an exact value of how much player X improved his speed or shooting accuracy. So I think it's reasonable that we only see a visual approximation of training efficiency, rather than absolute values.

Are you sure about that?

Are you telling us that in RL coaches don't know the physical parameters of their players? Guess again. :))

Re: Training efficiency

By viedras20 - 27-07-2021 19:46

[LT-Cm]

Tell me a physical parameter(s) that would directly indicate a player's tackling, passing or ball control ability.

mihairo wrote:

Are you sure about that?

Are you telling us that in RL coaches don't know the physical parameters of their players? Guess again. :))

Tell me a physical parameter(s) that would directly indicate a player's tackling, passing or ball control ability.

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 27-07-2021 22:25

[-FO-]

There are trainings for those as well. Just like penalty shots, or speed or endurance. They can be measured. For e.g. you have a speed session, and you measure the time for 100 meters and 200 meters. Let's say 11 seconds and 25 seconds. The next day you can repeat that session. A player makes the 100 m distance in 10 seconds and the 200 m distance in 24 seconds. He improves his performance by X %. It can be calculated. It's elementary Maths.There are trainings for those as well.
Just like penalty shots, or speed or endurance.
They can be measured.

For e.g. you have a speed session, and you measure the time for 100 meters and 200 meters. Let's say 11 seconds and 25 seconds.
The next day you can repeat that session. A player makes the 100 m distance in 10 seconds and the 200 m distance in 24 seconds.
He improves his performance by X %. It can be calculated. It's elementary Maths.

Re: Training efficiency

By viedras20 - 28-07-2021 11:21

[LT-Cm]

And the next day a player runs slower than the last day. Would you say it's an X percent deterioration? No, you have to gather data for a longer period of time to actually see any consistent improvement. But that's not the point. You haven't told me anything about reliable, directly related physical parameters for technical skills, only for speed, which is, of course, not that difficult to measure (even for stamina you have various parameters, such as VO2 max). Show me some elementary maths for technical skills, I'll wait.And the next day a player runs slower than the last day. Would you say it's an X percent deterioration? No, you have to gather data for a longer period of time to actually see any consistent improvement.

But that's not the point. You haven't told me anything about reliable, directly related physical parameters for technical skills, only for speed, which is, of course, not that difficult to measure (even for stamina you have various parameters, such as VO2 max). Show me some elementary maths for technical skills, I'll wait.

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 28-07-2021 11:53

[-FO-]

In MZ players deteriorate in physical skills after the age of 30. You cannot expect it to be exactly as in RL. Players don't have family issues, good days or bad days, or simply they aren't in the right mood. But pass percentage is measurable. Shot accuracy is measurable. Tackling percentage is measurable. Dribbling or ball control is measurable. There are exercises with the single purpose to control the ball. Freekicks percentage is measurable. Cross percentage is measurable. There are targets to hit in practice. Etc. A player can improve any skill with practice or training. That's the purpose of training. It would be nice in MZ to see percentage improvements. If you want to go further, it means changing the training in MZ as we know it. Because what you speak of (in RL) means actually training more than one particular skill in the same day. There are different training sessions in RL. Physical training is one thing and technical training is another. They all actually are done in the same day, every day. This is a job for them. You can't expect then to do just one thing over and over again. It's like not doing more than one thing at work in RL. We take it as it is in MZ. And as it is, they are getting better with training. More practice means getting better. It's simple as that.In MZ players deteriorate in physical skills after the age of 30. You cannot expect it to be exactly as in RL. Players don't have family issues, good days or bad days, or simply they aren't in the right mood.

But pass percentage is measurable. Shot accuracy is measurable. Tackling percentage is measurable. Dribbling or ball control is measurable. There are exercises with the single purpose to control the ball. Freekicks percentage is measurable. Cross percentage is measurable. There are targets to hit in practice. Etc.

A player can improve any skill with practice or training. That's the purpose of training.

It would be nice in MZ to see percentage improvements.

If you want to go further, it means changing the training in MZ as we know it. Because what you speak of (in RL) means actually training more than one particular skill in the same day.
There are different training sessions in RL. Physical training is one thing and technical training is another. They all actually are done in the same day, every day.

This is a job for them. You can't expect then to do just one thing over and over again.
It's like not doing more than one thing at work in RL.
We take it as it is in MZ.

And as it is, they are getting better with training. More practice means getting better.
It's simple as that.

Re: Training efficiency

By viedras20 - 28-07-2021 14:33

[LT-Cm]

You can easily access passes/tackles/shots percentage in match reports, which is the same as IRL. You can calculate changes in percentage from multiple matches if you like. But that is not a DIRECT measure of the improvement of these skills - it might be that a player passes better just because he plays in a different position, or because of the strength/play style of the opponent, not to mention many more specificities. That is why I'm saying that it's already good that we have an approximate indicator of improvement every day, which is enough already. And yes, MZ is far from real football, but why make it even less realistic?

mihairo wrote:

But pass percentage is measurable. Shot accuracy is measurable. Tackling percentage is measurable. Dribbling or ball control is measurable. There are exercises with the single purpose to control the ball. Freekicks percentage is measurable. Cross percentage is measurable. There are targets to hit in practice. Etc.

You can easily access passes/tackles/shots percentage in match reports, which is the same as IRL. You can calculate changes in percentage from multiple matches if you like. But that is not a DIRECT measure of the improvement of these skills - it might be that a player passes better just because he plays in a different position, or because of the strength/play style of the opponent, not to mention many more specificities. That is why I'm saying that it's already good that we have an approximate indicator of improvement every day, which is enough already.

And yes, MZ is far from real football, but why make it even less realistic?

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 28-07-2021 17:52

[-FO-]

The problem is that the training efficiency is random. If we had percentage, we can make it a managerial decision when we want to train a skill based on the player's training history. Id est I would also like to see the skills displayed that way. For e.g. I don't like the graphics of partial skills. I would very much like to see 8.95 instead of 8 and a big partial skill. The overall would also change based on every day training. We would not have just "balls" and partial skills. They should be added, as in 8.95+7.83+6.25 etc. This means that when a player turns 30, he would not lose 2 visual balls in 3 days, but only 0.02 in overall. The other great advantage would be that when we see % every day, we can actually choose if we want to train him faster in lower skills on slower in higher skills. For e.g. a player trains with 2% or 0.02 per day to gain stamina 10. This means that the player will gain stamina 10 in 50 training days. Meanwhile, if we choose to train him passing 6 we see a 7% or 0.07 per day. This means that the player will gain passing 6 in 15 days. Also, if we choose to train him header 4 we see a 10% or 0.1 per day. This means he will gain head 4 in 10 training days. More than that, if we choose to train him the latter, he will gain 2 balls in 25 training days, half the time he would gain stamina 10. Shouldn't be a managerial decision?The problem is that the training efficiency is random.
If we had percentage, we can make it a managerial decision when we want to train a skill based on the player's training history.
Id est I would also like to see the skills displayed that way.
For e.g. I don't like the graphics of partial skills. I would very much like to see 8.95 instead of 8 and a big partial skill.
The overall would also change based on every day training.
We would not have just "balls" and partial skills. They should be added, as in 8.95+7.83+6.25 etc. This means that when a player turns 30, he would not lose 2 visual balls in 3 days, but only 0.02 in overall.

The other great advantage would be that when we see % every day, we can actually choose if we want to train him faster in lower skills on slower in higher skills.

For e.g. a player trains with 2% or 0.02 per day to gain stamina 10. This means that the player will gain stamina 10 in 50 training days.
Meanwhile, if we choose to train him passing 6 we see a 7% or 0.07 per day. This means that the player will gain passing 6 in 15 days.
Also, if we choose to train him header 4 we see a 10% or 0.1 per day. This means he will gain head 4 in 10 training days.
More than that, if we choose to train him the latter, he will gain 2 balls in 25 training days, half the time he would gain stamina 10.

Shouldn't be a managerial decision?

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 28-07-2021 18:06

[-FO-]

With this said, IMO you actually don't know what a RL training looks like and you confuse match percentages with training percentages. Just add a simple "-1" and that's that.

viedras20 wrote:

You can easily access passes/tackles/shots percentage in match reports, which is the same as IRL. You can calculate changes in percentage from multiple matches if you like. But that is not a DIRECT measure of the improvement of these skills - it might be that a player passes better just because he plays in a different position, or because of the strength/play style of the opponent, not to mention many more specificities. That is why I'm saying that it's already good that we have an approximate indicator of improvement every day, which is enough already.

And yes, MZ is far from real football, but why make it even less realistic?

With this said, IMO you actually don't know what a RL training looks like and you confuse match percentages with training percentages.
Just add a simple "-1" and that's that.

Re: Training efficiency

By viedras20 - 28-07-2021 19:37

[LT-Cm]

Can you explain to me a little better how training IRL works? Also, which team are you working for as a coach?

mihairo wrote:

With this said, IMO you actually don't know what a RL training looks like and you confuse match percentages with training percentages.
Just add a simple "-1" and that's that.

Can you explain to me a little better how training IRL works? Also, which team are you working for as a coach?

Re: Training efficiency

By mihairo - 29-07-2021 06:41

[-FO-]

You don't have to be a RL coach to play football in the Junior League for e.g. That's how you can see elementary training. I'm sure there are others more qualified than me to explain it to you. But the general idea is that you do have cardio/fitness/strength exercises, speed exercises with and without obstacles, technical exercises like moving the ball through obstacles from point A to point B without knocking them down (the time is also essential), free kicks, offensive and defensive plays, how to receive the ball with your head, chest or leg (knee and foot), how to stop/tackle the ball from different angles, how to kick a still or moving ball etc. If you do that every day, you have a certain % of improvement. Everything I explained here is measurable. The player succeeds in % of the parameters. Cristiano Ronaldo spent 2 hours after training just for practicing his free kicks. In the end, it's just 5% talent, 10% luck and 85% work if you want to become great at what you do. And I don't agree that a coach / general manager doesn't know his players' parameters. He is also helped by an entire staff do know.You don't have to be a RL coach to play football in the Junior League for e.g.
That's how you can see elementary training. I'm sure there are others more qualified than me to explain it to you.

But the general idea is that you do have cardio/fitness/strength exercises, speed exercises with and without obstacles, technical exercises like moving the ball through obstacles from point A to point B without knocking them down (the time is also essential), free kicks, offensive and defensive plays, how to receive the ball with your head, chest or leg (knee and foot), how to stop/tackle the ball from different angles, how to kick a still or moving ball etc.
If you do that every day, you have a certain % of improvement. Everything I explained here is measurable.
The player succeeds in % of the parameters.

Cristiano Ronaldo spent 2 hours after training just for practicing his free kicks.

In the end, it's just 5% talent, 10% luck and 85% work if you want to become great at what you do.

And I don't agree that a coach / general manager doesn't know his players' parameters. He is also helped by an entire staff do know.

 

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