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28-03-2024 12:36
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Season 89 · Week 13 · Day 87
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Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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Keepers with 10 skill ball in keeping and experience making mistakes left and right, experienced 9 skill ball finishers can't finish one of 15 shots, midfielders with 9 skill balls in ball control losing the ball, defenders with 10 in tackling 9 in experience incapable of tackling.

I'm about to start my academy team instead.

A few of my opponent make their player's skills public, I saw a 25 year old with 7 experience, 5 speed and 8 shooting skill balls score a hat trick. In that game my striker with 9 in speed, experience, and shooting got so many shots, more than 10 and NOTHING. To end up eliminated from a Cup by 1 or 2 points.

I don't like this at all, I need explanation not excuses
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Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[FLUSA]
President
When things like this happen is annoying, but it happens, sometimes your team has an off game, sometimes your team seems to under perform on a certain competition while doing ok on others, is pretty much like my MLS season, I'm always competing for the title and I won it last season but with the same team, players & tactics, I've been struggling this season for no reason in particular, my team is just under performing on the MLS and I lost some games that I should have won easily.

In any case, on the long run if you do things well you'll get the results because otherwise you wouldn't see the same bunch of teams always winning or leagues & cups.

Anyway, if you want to post the game that'll be great, there might be a tactical explanation.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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even if your skill is 10/10, you still have to roll a dice in the end

10/10 doesn't mean that no matter what you roll, you will always win

you can still fumble and lose from an "inferior" opponent in the end

annoying? yes!
but such is life in MZ

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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I spent over 6 mil euros on this player :
Zernin Tiagonce

Age: 47 (Retired)



Probably the amount is higher than your whole team, and yet, my striker did not score in the latest game :
https://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&mid=1029189689&tid=161343

Explanation ?
It takes more than a certain number of balls to win a game/score goals/ defend ...

I hope you like my explanation :D

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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aurelrabei wrote:
I spent over 6 mil euros on this player :
Zernin Tiagonce

Age: 47 (Retired)



Probably the amount is higher than your whole team, and yet, my striker did not score in the latest game :
https://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&mid=1029189689&tid=161343

Explanation ?
It takes more than a certain number of balls to win a game/score goals/ defend ...

I hope you like my explanation :D


I loved

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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darkline wrote:
When things like this happen is annoying, but it happens, sometimes your team has an off game, sometimes your team seems to under perform on a certain competition while doing ok on others, is pretty much like my MLS season, I'm always competing for the title and I won it last season but with the same team, players & tactics, I've been struggling this season for no reason in particular, my team is just under performing on the MLS and I lost some games that I should have won easily.

In any case, on the long run if you do things well you'll get the results because otherwise you wouldn't see the same bunch of teams always winning or leagues & cups.

Anyway, if you want to post the game that'll be great, there might be a tactical explanation.


Every season we have to find something new, something to improve, It was what I understood so far in MZ.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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aurelrabei wrote:
I spent over 6 mil euros on this player :
Zernin Tiagonce

Age: 47 (Retired)



thanks, that will come a bit handy in our next NT match :P

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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I think the Crew is trolling me, I lost to a team that took 36 shots and scored twice, my team took 6 shots and scored once.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[AUSNZ]
President
I just looked at 4 of your last losses in senior games. I’d start with your tactics if you aren’t happy with results.

One match you played with a winger on both sides of the field. Very few teams in the world have ever made that work and I don’t know one team still playing it effectively.

Your favoured SP tactic has such a wide midfield anyone playing a compressed SP is tearing you up through the middle. Your back 3-2 is also very wide so your not defending SP to the best ability and they aren’t wide enough to cover wings.

This is all on face value (unless you have hidden tactics in ALT formations)

That’s just a very quick analysis. I don’t claim to be an expert but if you changed a few of these things I can almost guarantee better results shot v goals conversion aside.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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And here I am just keep on winning and dont know what to do with the wins anymore.

For those of you in darkline's shoes, if you dont win and you feel like blaming Trump or so, just go 1 or 2 divisions down and then you will win like me.

You should only spend 6 millions on kanga steak and maple syrup. Keep it fun, roll a greek dice and eat greek salad.

And if your players are unloyal like the disloyalone, fire them all.


Unloyal aint really a word.. but it feels so greek...

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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chucky06 wrote:
I just looked at 4 of your last losses in senior games. I’d start with your tactics if you aren’t happy with results.

One match you played with a winger on both sides of the field. Very few teams in the world have ever made that work and I don’t know one team still playing it effectively.

Your favoured SP tactic has such a wide midfield anyone playing a compressed SP is tearing you up through the middle. Your back 3-2 is also very wide so your not defending SP to the best ability and they aren’t wide enough to cover wings.

This is all on face value (unless you have hidden tactics in ALT formations)

That’s just a very quick analysis. I don’t claim to be an expert but if you changed a few of these things I can almost guarantee better results shot v goals conversion aside.


I know that my formation is a unorthodox but almost every formation will have players that essentially don't contribute. For example, if my opponent plays with 3 at the back the wingers will usually distract at least one of the those defenders, and often two of the three, leaving space for the two attacking mids, which are my best players. Those wingers will rarely score or make a killer pass but with one defender taking on two or three attackers in the middle the odds, in theory, should be in my favor. When the other team plays with four at the back it gets trickier but my two attacking midfielders are usually more than up to the task, either scoring or making the killer pass. That's where it gets frustrating. So you have your opponents opening themselves up and a player with 9 shooting skill balls needs 15-20 shots to make a difference, so why worry about tactics?

I have used the conventional formations as well, in cups I use the winger system, I've used quick ones, the best crosser, put the winger as a forward, as a midfielder, closer to the striker, but I haven't seen anything that would make me want to change things. I've tried the formation vs one of the teams that got promoted and isn't doing well and it ended in a 0-0 tied, I dropped two points.

I just feel the the SIM takes some things into account that has nothing to do with tactics or skills. For example, if I play a top 20 team in the world, with much better players but inferior tactics, then the talent wins out. Then for some reason, some times, not always but some times, you need to take 20-30 shots to KO an minnow.

To be sure, if you go back to most results and compare the team values, my team has an impressive record of scalps against much better teams. But then there are the dumb results vs minnows and then default wins to the better teams because they have better players, but inferior tactics. That's my sticking point.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[AUSNZ]
President
I think we will have to agree to disagree.

There is much better proven wing tactics to play against a 3 at the back formation as well as better SP tactics.

I understand what you are trying to do and how the tactic is supposed to work and essentially it might sometimes, but it’s still inferior to others out there. That’s just my opinion though :)

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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I think when comes down to a ball V

Start to think about formation over balls

When u get down to the nit'y grit'y

Comes back to knowing positing and ball for at @

End of day gotta be lucky be give self best chance of luck draw.

9 is nether 10....

But u have 10 where he has 9... SO

Luck rat on.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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BTW when my National coach is in forum asking for advise on something I like it!!!!

Means he don't think he is beyond help...

I like this!

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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So instead of BANGING him.

PLEASE LETS SEE SOME HELP TO HIS QUESTION!

This guy is a National manager!

Sv: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[TDF]
President
Gotta agree with chucky. Your formation is with no offense pretty weak

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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I think the formation is fine (3-2-2-3), I actually saw Patrick Vieira use it in real life, they use it in the Man City Elite Academy, I actually changed it this week after this post. In terms as defensive effort is great, in World Leagues and Regular league I usually have the best or one of the best defensive record. The wing play of other teams CAN be effective but I've seen it so many times that if my defense wasn't up for it I would've changed it a long time ago. As for my tactics, is offensive and small passing not wing play, I use the two outside strikers as decoys, they attract defenders. The offense comes from the two midfielders behind the center forward, they're both rated as better forwards than midfielders. The other two midfielders were two central defenders, I push up the defense as close to the midfield as possible to make it feel like a 5 men defense.

I also you my A tactic as a decoy, it's Long or Wing passing with mostly bench players.

I know all about the wing play, 5 man defense, etc. I've seen the NT teams and division one teams. They usually give up possession and their lone winger rarely gets the ball. If they do the defensive midfielders, which are really central defenders, cover for the defender that gets pulled out.

I have seen sequences in cup games where my defense will pass the ball backwards, 5-6 passes, just so when they lose the ball the other team can score. That's what i"m referring to in the SIM, it tries to make up for the difference in talent.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[AUSNZ]
President
mtavarez wrote:
I think the formation is fine (3-2-2-3), I actually saw Patrick Vieira use it in real life, they use it in the Man City Elite Academy,


Trying to play real life tactics in a simulated (badly simulated) Manager game is a problem in itself.

You keep doing your thing, I was only trying to give advice at better wing tactics. Straight away if you want to play with two wingers, playing them both on the same side works much better, just things like that.

You seem pretty set on your ways so I wish you good luck :)

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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You should follow my theory of 'Minimal interest minimal problems'.

Basically, it means, the more 'carefree' you are about the results, they will end up surprising you (in a nice way, more often than now) :)

The problem begins when u start taking a keen interest in your tactics and over-think ;)

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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about the results (and your tactics)*

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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than not*

it seems like i worry more about my typos than the results :P

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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Hail to the disloyal one, takes him 3 posts to say one thing.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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chucky06 wrote:
Trying to play real life tactics in a simulated (badly simulated) Manager game is a problem in itself.


this

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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aldebaran wrote:
this


Yeah, but watabout Patrick Vieira?

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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So you just to recapitulate:

-Just because I have had good defensive records in my leagues, usually the best or second best, doesn't mean I have a good defense.

-Even though I out shoot my opponents and still score less, means that I should move my strikers in a different position.

-The SIM is not out whack

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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[AUSNZ]
President
I was merely suggesting a few proven ways and tactics to improve your team before you go bashing the simulator.

In your current US division 1 league you're in 7th position. You yes, haven't conceded that many goals but you have the fourth worst attacking record only scoring 19 goals in 12 matches. Playing wings, (properly) usually would generate a lot more goals at the shots v goals is proportionately increased compared to SP, especially against the bottom sides in your league. Again, generalizing but it's valid in this very quick analysis.

Every team above you has a higher average age besides one (more experienced players) and every team above you is worth at least 1 million dollars more than yours besides one. On those statistics, your position on the ladder is justified. I know that's only a small analysis but does highlight a few things and gives you more perspective hopefully.

Re: Since when is having 9 skill balls a liability?

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I'll look into the wing formation, I have tried it in Cups and World League games. The results are hit or miss, the thing is that when I develop a strategy it usually works better than the norm, and that's the goal isn't it?

You hit the nail in the head though with the position being justified, but that's the point. If you're not Barcelona and Real Madrid you're not favored to win the league, but that's what I'm trying to do. Before this season I had to sell my two most experienced players, a striker that led the league in goals, and a very capable midfielder. Because my A tactic is just for friendlies with bench players, I forgot to change it for a league game and barely missed out on the play-offs. The previous season I actually made the play-offs. So I'm punching above my weight, that's why you can laugh at my tactics but they're giving me results. I have noticed that the SIM tries to "correct" results in unusual ways, that's what kills me. The real answer is to wait until I can buy mega stars and just impose my style.

I have two suggestions for the SIM: Make tackling more important so that strikers get less chances at goal, but make the chances count. Another is to either make it easier to gain experience or don't make experience so valuable. There are 24 year old players with great skills that can't start because they can have 10 skill balls and still look like youth players! Especially in a sport where 18 year olds are breaking out all the times.
 
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