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Exorbitant transfer price demands

By frankiejhoffa - 18-11-2017 00:30

[AUSNZ]

The market is now full of huge prices placed on players that will never be realised. My solution is a tax of $100000 USD on a player who is listed for sale of 4 million dollars or more to be paid if the player does not get a bid Thoughts HoffaThe market is now full of huge prices placed on players that will never be realised.

My solution is a tax of $100000 USD on a player who is listed for sale of 4 million dollars or more to be paid if the player does not get a bid

Thoughts
Hoffa

 

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Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aurelrabei - 18-11-2017 00:44

[BotP]

The forum is full of managers complaining about one thing or another, even tho there are the same rules for everybody. My solution is to fine these managers with $100000 USD if their solution doesn't work [:D] Thoughts ? PS: Sorry Hoffa, i just couldn't help it [;)]The forum is full of managers complaining about one thing or another, even tho there are the same rules for everybody.
My solution is to fine these managers with $100000 USD if their solution doesn't work :D

Thoughts ?

PS: Sorry Hoffa, i just couldn't help it ;)

Edited: 18-11-2017 10:40
Total edits: 1

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 18-11-2017 10:47

eventually they will get bored having to put players on the TL and not getting a bid or forced to lower their demands when the IMF (bankruptcy) starts knocking on their door the market will regulate itself also (hopefully) the high transfer prices will help to draw away much faster that extra money that's causing the inflation of prices (because there will still be managers willing to pay the higher asking prices (taxes+high salaries will siphon money away from the game))eventually they will get bored having to put players on the TL and not getting a bid
or forced to lower their demands when the IMF (bankruptcy) starts knocking on their door

the market will regulate itself

also (hopefully) the high transfer prices will help to draw away much faster that extra money that's causing the inflation of prices (because there will still be managers willing to pay the higher asking prices (taxes+high salaries will siphon money away from the game))

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 18-11-2017 13:44

[WCE]
President

Actually they don't. I have seen the same Norwegian player entering the transfer market more than 20 times these last couple of seasons [:O] They are relentless, and don't have a single ounce of "give up" in them. The idea of a heavier taxation is perfectly valid in my opinion. The tax should only be paid if the player doesn't sell.

aldebaran wrote:

eventually they will get bored having to put players on the TL and not getting a bid

Actually they don't. I have seen the same Norwegian player entering the transfer market more than 20 times these last couple of seasons :O

They are relentless, and don't have a single ounce of "give up" in them.

The idea of a heavier taxation is perfectly valid in my opinion. The tax should only be paid if the player doesn't sell.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 18-11-2017 14:28

I have no problem with raising the upper limit of the transfer placement tariff (the max is 5k now) the problem is to find the right balance, cause if you raise it too much, you might end up seeing even less players on the transfer list or force the majority of transfer s being made through chat/gb and not through the random bid on the TL for example I don't like to haggle for transfer nor do I like the idea of those forum threads "here is my player, these are his maxed skills, make me an offer so for me to place him on the TL" Nor do I want to be forced to pay big bucks when I put up a player for sale without having first found the buyer through chat/forum/gb (I don't mean asking 4mil for a 500k worth of a player) and because my timing was bad Like I said, I'm in favour of having money siphoned out of the MZ economy, but it has to be done right so you won't be seeing transfers asking ridiculous amounts of money but also you won't be hurting the rest of the "honest" or casual gamers of MZI have no problem with raising the upper limit of the transfer placement tariff (the max is 5k now)

the problem is to find the right balance, cause if you raise it too much, you might end up seeing even less players on the transfer list or force the majority of transfer s being made through chat/gb and not through the random bid on the TL

for example

I don't like to haggle for transfer nor do I like the idea of those forum threads "here is my player, these are his maxed skills, make me an offer so for me to place him on the TL"

Nor do I want to be forced to pay big bucks when I put up a player for sale without having first found the buyer through chat/forum/gb (I don't mean asking 4mil for a 500k worth of a player) and because my timing was bad

Like I said, I'm in favour of having money siphoned out of the MZ economy, but it has to be done right so you won't be seeing transfers asking ridiculous amounts of money but also you won't be hurting the rest of the "honest" or casual gamers of MZ

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By azkaban-za - 18-11-2017 16:49

[ᴀғяιcᴀ]
President

I agree

hanzinho wrote:

Actually they don't. I have seen the same Norwegian player entering the transfer market more than 20 times these last couple of seasons :O

They are relentless, and don't have a single ounce of "give up" in them.

The idea of a heavier taxation is perfectly valid in my opinion. The tax should only be paid if the player doesn't sell.

I agree

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 18-11-2017 20:29

[FLUSA]
President

Let people try to sell their players for whatever they want, there's no point in trying to regulate the market, if a player is listed for too much money he won't sell, if you don't want to see players with a value higher than any amount you can use the search filters.Let people try to sell their players for whatever they want, there's no point in trying to regulate the market, if a player is listed for too much money he won't sell, if you don't want to see players with a value higher than any amount you can use the search filters.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 19-11-2017 02:41

[WCE]
President

People can still sell players for whatever they want (within the 5x limitation) even if the tax is increased. Do you even believe this yourself? I have seen countless players being listed for waaay too much, and sold. But it happens very infrequently. Ergo, people using this "fishing" method try this over and over and over until they strike gold. Sometimes it can take 5 attempts. Other times, even 20 times isn't enough to get a bid. You could even remove the transfer tax for all I care, but there should certainly be a fee if the player doesn't sell. It will encourage these users to think before they set the asking price. An example from some weeks ago: One user set an asking price of 2 million euro, for a player that was worth 1/6 of that. He tried it a few times. Then on 3rd or 4th attempt an inexperienced manager made the bid. Buyer then tried to sell the same player some weeks thereafter, and had to settle for 1/6th of what he bought him for. I could give lots of examples of this, just from the Norwegian transfer market alone.

darkline wrote:

Let people try to sell their players for whatever they want, there's no point in trying to regulate the market

People can still sell players for whatever they want (within the 5x limitation) even if the tax is increased.

darkline wrote:

if a player is listed for too much money he won't sell

Do you even believe this yourself?
I have seen countless players being listed for waaay too much, and sold. But it happens very infrequently. Ergo, people using this "fishing" method try this over and over and over until they strike gold. Sometimes it can take 5 attempts. Other times, even 20 times isn't enough to get a bid.

You could even remove the transfer tax for all I care, but there should certainly be a fee if the player doesn't sell. It will encourage these users to think before they set the asking price.

An example from some weeks ago: One user set an asking price of 2 million euro, for a player that was worth 1/6 of that. He tried it a few times. Then on 3rd or 4th attempt an inexperienced manager made the bid. Buyer then tried to sell the same player some weeks thereafter, and had to settle for 1/6th of what he bought him for. I could give lots of examples of this, just from the Norwegian transfer market alone.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By frankiejhoffa - 19-11-2017 06:35

[AUSNZ]

Sounds dodgy like a 2nd account. The price increase just makes it easier. The new system needs to be further tuned - like maybe you can only list the same player 4 times a month

hanzinho wrote:

People can still sell players for whatever they want (within the 5x limitation) even if the tax is increased.




An example from some weeks ago: One user set an asking price of 2 million euro, for a player that was worth 1/6 of that. He tried it a few times. Then on 3rd or 4th attempt an inexperienced manager made the bid. Buyer then tried to sell the same player some weeks thereafter, and had to settle for 1/6th of what he bought him for. I could give lots of examples of this, just from the Norwegian transfer market alone.

Sounds dodgy like a 2nd account. The price increase just makes it easier.
The new system needs to be further tuned - like maybe you can only list the same player 4 times a month

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aurelrabei - 19-11-2017 09:22

[BotP]

Let's increase the fee, let's limit the number of a player being listed and then , later we can complain about why there are no players on the market. Smart thinking guysLet's increase the fee, let's limit the number of a player being listed and then , later we can complain about why there are no players on the market.
Smart thinking guys

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 19-11-2017 11:20

you can't limit the number of transfer listed players what if someone decides to sell everything end start from scratch during the season? you still want that manager into the game, you don't want to give him another reason to just quit or if someone is on the verge of bankruptcy and he has already sold the max allowed number of players? and for that same reason(bankrupt) you just can't go establishing a fee for unsold players you will either have to increase taxes on profit according to the final price (ie (random numbers) 10% tax on the 1st million, 20%on the 2nd million etc etc) made and/or increase the transfer listing feeyou can't limit the number of transfer listed players

what if someone decides to sell everything end start from scratch during the season?
you still want that manager into the game, you don't want to give him another reason to just quit

or if someone is on the verge of bankruptcy and he has already sold the max allowed number of players?

and for that same reason(bankrupt) you just can't go establishing a fee for unsold players

you will either have to increase taxes on profit according to the final price (ie (random numbers) 10% tax on the 1st million, 20%on the 2nd million etc etc) made and/or increase the transfer listing fee

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 19-11-2017 13:29

[FLUSA]
President

If someone pays the money, then the seller is right in setting the price he wants for his player, might not be worth that money for you but obviously is worth it for someone else. Imagine you want to sell your old TV at a car boot for $500 and someone comes and tells you that the highest you can try to sell your TV is $50 because it isn't worth more than that and it would be unfair for the potential buyers, wouldn't that be silly? Or what about Neymar and his 222 million euros transfer? I think he's not worth it but PSG obviously doesn't agree, now could you imagine FIFA telling clubs that the higher they can set the release clause of any player is 3X or 5X what they originally paid for the player? First off, 2 million euro is on a price range that you could list a player since the early times of MZ, so that's nothing new, but the problem is a different one.... why is it that an inexperienced manager has 2 million euro? When I started playing this game more than 10 years ago, it took me a year to get 1 million and I felt like I was rich, now you can get a couple of millions as a newbie in a very short time and that's because making money is too easy, there's just too much money around and this started with the bonuses & the Uxx competitions in which teams can earn as much as a senior team but with extremely low expenses in salaries and no risks of losing money to retirements & deteriorations.

hanzinho wrote:

Do you even believe this yourself?
I have seen countless players being listed for waaay too much, and sold. But it happens very infrequently. Ergo, people using this "fishing" method try this over and over and over until they strike gold. Sometimes it can take 5 attempts. Other times, even 20 times isn't enough to get a bid.

If someone pays the money, then the seller is right in setting the price he wants for his player, might not be worth that money for you but obviously is worth it for someone else.

Imagine you want to sell your old TV at a car boot for $500 and someone comes and tells you that the highest you can try to sell your TV is $50 because it isn't worth more than that and it would be unfair for the potential buyers, wouldn't that be silly? Or what about Neymar and his 222 million euros transfer? I think he's not worth it but PSG obviously doesn't agree, now could you imagine FIFA telling clubs that the higher they can set the release clause of any player is 3X or 5X what they originally paid for the player?

hanzinho wrote:

An example from some weeks ago: One user set an asking price of 2 million euro, for a player that was worth 1/6 of that. He tried it a few times. Then on 3rd or 4th attempt an inexperienced manager made the bid. Buyer then tried to sell the same player some weeks thereafter, and had to settle for 1/6th of what he bought him for. I could give lots of examples of this, just from the Norwegian transfer market alone.

First off, 2 million euro is on a price range that you could list a player since the early times of MZ, so that's nothing new, but the problem is a different one.... why is it that an inexperienced manager has 2 million euro? When I started playing this game more than 10 years ago, it took me a year to get 1 million and I felt like I was rich, now you can get a couple of millions as a newbie in a very short time and that's because making money is too easy, there's just too much money around and this started with the bonuses & the Uxx competitions in which teams can earn as much as a senior team but with extremely low expenses in salaries and no risks of losing money to retirements & deteriorations.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 19-11-2017 14:21

[WCE]
President

No they are not worth the money, because shortly thereafter they realize their mistake and resell the player for a fraction of what they paid initially. Here is a random example from the top of my head: 200056448 Do you even visit the transfer market at all? [:O] I am writing a newspaper for the Norwegian community, and I include transfers from all over the world in a transfer section. I create a "transfer history" (with graphs) for each player. There is no cheating here, but managerial errors. Inexperienced managers sometimes pay way more than they should, it an error on their part. The player is [b]not[/b] worth the money they pay. There are some ways this can happen. 1. A bidfight, where things get a bit heated. 2. Guarantee bids, where you often have to offer a bit more for the player than he is worth, because the owner might not be keen on selling. 3. The seller is setting a very high asking price, where the buyer is miscalculating the value of the player. 4. A player is adding a digit too many when placing the bid. 5. Outright cheating. 1 and 2 are game mechanics that makes the game more interesting in my opinion. Number 5 is dealt with by MA/GA's (possibly number 4 also). That leaves us with number 3, spamming the transfer market. Who mentioned anything about limiting the number of players being listed?

darkline wrote:

If someone pays the money, then the seller is right in setting the price he wants for his player, might not be worth that money for you but obviously is worth it for someone else.

No they are not worth the money, because shortly thereafter they realize their mistake and resell the player for a fraction of what they paid initially. Here is a random example from the top of my head: 200056448

Do you even visit the transfer market at all? :O

I am writing a newspaper for the Norwegian community, and I include transfers from all over the world in a transfer section. I create a "transfer history" (with graphs) for each player. There is no cheating here, but managerial errors. Inexperienced managers sometimes pay way more than they should, it an error on their part. The player is not worth the money they pay.

There are some ways this can happen.
1. A bidfight, where things get a bit heated.
2. Guarantee bids, where you often have to offer a bit more for the player than he is worth, because the owner might not be keen on selling.
3. The seller is setting a very high asking price, where the buyer is miscalculating the value of the player.
4. A player is adding a digit too many when placing the bid.
5. Outright cheating.

1 and 2 are game mechanics that makes the game more interesting in my opinion. Number 5 is dealt with by MA/GA's (possibly number 4 also). That leaves us with number 3, spamming the transfer market.

aurelrabei wrote:

Let's increase the fee, let's limit the number of a player being listed and then , later we can complain about why there are no players on the market.
Smart thinking guys

Who mentioned anything about limiting the number of players being listed?

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 19-11-2017 17:46

[FLUSA]
President

Player bought by a manager that have been 4 years in the game.... so we need more safeguards to protect managers from their own lack of judgement or ability now? Anyway, player could be worth $1.6M and max on lets say 4 Pi a few days after you buy it and then quite obviously the price of the player will drop....

hanzinho wrote:

No they are not worth the money, because shortly thereafter they realize their mistake and resell the player for a fraction of what they paid initially. Here is a random example from the top of my head: 200056448

Do you even visit the transfer market at all? :O

Player bought by a manager that have been 4 years in the game.... so we need more safeguards to protect managers from their own lack of judgement or ability now?

Anyway, player could be worth $1.6M and max on lets say 4 Pi a few days after you buy it and then quite obviously the price of the player will drop....

Uuesti: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By sandoz - 19-11-2017 18:08

[Eesti]

Like with many things, we could call it idiot tax. I can't imagine why we're even arguing over baiting users. It should be deterred at any costs.Like with many things, we could call it idiot tax. I can't imagine why we're even arguing over baiting users. It should be deterred at any costs.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 19-11-2017 19:44

[WCE]
President

No, he was never worth 1,6 million dollars. I understand you need this to make sense, but it doesn't. Sometimes managers make huge mistakes on the transfer market. He was bought for 11 655 254 NOK (1,6 mill dollars). He was sold 3 weeks later for 2 567 270 NOK. His skills and maxings and age was [u]identical[/u]. There are managers who have played this game 4 years, 6 years, etc. whom can be considered rookies. If you aren't playing this game very actively, it doesn't matter when you started playing. But that is beside the point. We can't build a safeguard against miscalculations, as mistakes will always happen on the transfer market. But you can atleast make it less lucrative fishing for highprice.

darkline wrote:

Player bought by a manager that have been 4 years in the game.... so we need more safeguards to protect managers from their own lack of judgement or ability now?

Anyway, player could be worth $1.6M and max on lets say 4 Pi a few days after you buy it and then quite obviously the price of the player will drop....

No, he was never worth 1,6 million dollars. I understand you need this to make sense, but it doesn't. Sometimes managers make huge mistakes on the transfer market.

He was bought for 11 655 254 NOK (1,6 mill dollars). He was sold 3 weeks later for 2 567 270 NOK. His skills and maxings and age was identical.

There are managers who have played this game 4 years, 6 years, etc. whom can be considered rookies. If you aren't playing this game very actively, it doesn't matter when you started playing. But that is beside the point.

We can't build a safeguard against miscalculations, as mistakes will always happen on the transfer market. But you can atleast make it less lucrative fishing for highprice.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 19-11-2017 19:45

[WCE]
President

I like the name for the tax. It is exactly what it is! :)

sandoz wrote:

Like with many things, we could call it idiot tax. I can't imagine why we're even arguing over baiting users. It should be deterred at any costs.

I like the name for the tax. It is exactly what it is! :)

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By frankiejhoffa - 21-11-2017 02:44

[AUSNZ]

Sounds good - anything listed over 4 million gets a 10% extra taxSounds good - anything listed over 4 million gets a 10% extra tax

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aurelrabei - 21-11-2017 08:13

[BotP]

Oh Hanz, you like to bla-bla, don't ya ? [:D]

aurelrabei wrote:

... let's limit the number of a player being listed ...

hanzinho wrote:

Who mentioned anything about limiting the number of players being listed?

frankiejhoffa wrote:

The new system needs to be further tuned - like maybe you can only list the same player 4 times a month

Oh Hanz, you like to bla-bla, don't ya ? :D

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By civilu - 21-11-2017 09:00

[RAF]
President

[b]Aurel[/b], [color=red]*** ****[/color] even as a troll. Please contribute to the topic or... exist, stage left! _________________ To the point, I always hated people who fish for bids from rookies or newbies and list players for much more than they are worth, just maybe... I too agree that [b]the transfer fee should remain a percentile of the asking price[/b] and not stop at 5.000 EUR, to deter managers from asking indecent/empty prices endless times. [color=red]Please use dedicated threads for such words /aurel[/color]Aurel, *** **** even as a troll. Please contribute to the topic or... exist, stage left!
_________________

To the point, I always hated people who fish for bids from rookies or newbies and list players for much more than they are worth, just maybe... I too agree that the transfer fee should remain a percentile of the asking price and not stop at 5.000 EUR, to deter managers from asking indecent/empty prices endless times.

Please use dedicated threads for such words
/aurel

Edited: 21-11-2017 09:35
Total edits: 1

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By sunhound - 21-11-2017 10:41

[DISCLL]

Shouldn't this have been expected, once the decision was made to raise the transfer price threshold? A vote was made on it, it was seemingly conclusive and a suitable resolution has been implemented. You could argue that the process is democratic and that the markets will regulate themselves. On the other hand, you want to regulate abuse. Ultimately, its just a case of reaping what you sow, unless another vote is introduced.Shouldn't this have been expected, once the decision was made to raise the transfer price threshold?

A vote was made on it, it was seemingly conclusive and a suitable resolution has been implemented.

You could argue that the process is democratic and that the markets will regulate themselves. On the other hand, you want to regulate abuse.

Ultimately, its just a case of reaping what you sow, unless another vote is introduced.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 21-11-2017 11:14

the power is in the hands of the bidder/buyer simply don't bid/buy the over priced player(s) eventually the owner will be forced to lower his demands (if it takes 10 seasons or 10 years...that's another issue) as for the new or inexperienced managers...well...put some pointers in the manual and/or forumthe power is in the hands of the bidder/buyer

simply don't bid/buy the over priced player(s)
eventually the owner will be forced to lower his demands (if it takes 10 seasons or 10 years...that's another issue)

as for the new or inexperienced managers...well...put some pointers in the manual and/or forum

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 21-11-2017 12:19

[WCE]
President

You are a forum assistant. Perhaps you should stop the trolling. New managers seeing assistants trying to ridicule users doesn't bode well. I am yet to see you contribute to this thread in any capacity, except trying to wind people up. And to answer you. I actually hadn't seen that suggestion by the OP. I disagree with that limitation. There are those who miscalculate what their player is worth. Fair mistake. They will learn, and adapt. They will learn faster if the transfer fee is increased (of course). Then there are those who do this as a tactic to get more for their player than he is worth. They just need to be lucky once every blue moon, and the extra money they get for the player help fund this tactic (transfer fee) for the next seasons. If the tax is increased, then it will prevent this tactic from being financially sustainable.

aurelrabei wrote:

Oh Hanz, you like to bla-bla, don't ya ? :D

You are a forum assistant. Perhaps you should stop the trolling.
New managers seeing assistants trying to ridicule users doesn't bode well.

I am yet to see you contribute to this thread in any capacity, except trying to wind people up.

And to answer you. I actually hadn't seen that suggestion by the OP. I disagree with that limitation.

aldebaran wrote:

eventually the owner will be forced to lower his demands (if it takes 10 seasons or 10 years...that's another issue)

There are those who miscalculate what their player is worth. Fair mistake. They will learn, and adapt. They will learn faster if the transfer fee is increased (of course).

Then there are those who do this as a tactic to get more for their player than he is worth. They just need to be lucky once every blue moon, and the extra money they get for the player help fund this tactic (transfer fee) for the next seasons. If the tax is increased, then it will prevent this tactic from being financially sustainable.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 21-11-2017 12:43

@hanzinho I agree with the raise of transfer fee I'm skeptical though about the implementation I wouldn't want the casual manager (like me) to suffer by not being able to find players on the TL because of high transfer fees (I like to browse and not haggle) Also I wouldn't want to go into a "closed bid" situation that would only help the seller, because this is what will happen if the transfer fee is way too high@hanzinho

I agree with the raise of transfer fee

I'm skeptical though about the implementation

I wouldn't want the casual manager (like me) to suffer by not being able to find players on the TL because of high transfer fees (I like to browse and not haggle)

Also I wouldn't want to go into a "closed bid" situation that would only help the seller, because this is what will happen if the transfer fee is way too high

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 21-11-2017 14:24

[WCE]
President

I agree with you that such a fee should be implemented in a way that removes/reduces the players with ridiculous asking prices without limiting regular transfers. I am not one to haggle outside the transfer market either. As mentioned, one possibility could be a "deposit" fee that you will get back if the player is actually sold. This fee could be like 2% of the asking price, and be called an administration or agent fee. It would help remove money from the game aswell (which is good!). If it doesn't reduce the amount of legitimate players on the transfer market, then it is a very good solution in my opinion. Maybe this fee could replace the regular transfer fee altogether, to simplify it. 1,5 of the 2% being the deposit fee (refunded if the player is sold), while 0,5 being the regular transfer fee (which is not refunded). Example 1: If you set an asking price of 1 million euro 15 000 euro (1,5% of asking price) is taken as a deposit. 5 000 euro (0,5% of asking price) is the transfer fee. Example 2: If you set an asking price of 3 million euro 45 000 euro (1,5% of asking price) is taken as a deposit. 15 000 euro (0,5% of asking price) is the transfer fee.

aldebaran wrote:

@hanzinho

I agree with the raise of transfer fee

I'm skeptical though about the implementation

I wouldn't want the casual manager (like me) to suffer by not being able to find players on the TL because of high transfer fees (I like to browse and not haggle)

Also I wouldn't want to go into a "closed bid" situation that would only help the seller, because this is what will happen if the transfer fee is way too high

I agree with you that such a fee should be implemented in a way that removes/reduces the players with ridiculous asking prices without limiting regular transfers. I am not one to haggle outside the transfer market either.

As mentioned, one possibility could be a "deposit" fee that you will get back if the player is actually sold. This fee could be like 2% of the asking price, and be called an administration or agent fee. It would help remove money from the game aswell (which is good!). If it doesn't reduce the amount of legitimate players on the transfer market, then it is a very good solution in my opinion.

Maybe this fee could replace the regular transfer fee altogether, to simplify it.
1,5 of the 2% being the deposit fee (refunded if the player is sold), while 0,5 being the regular transfer fee (which is not refunded).

Example 1:
If you set an asking price of 1 million euro
15 000 euro (1,5% of asking price) is taken as a deposit.
5 000 euro (0,5% of asking price) is the transfer fee.

Example 2:
If you set an asking price of 3 million euro
45 000 euro (1,5% of asking price) is taken as a deposit.
15 000 euro (0,5% of asking price) is the transfer fee.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 21-11-2017 15:03

[FLUSA]
President

Let's just force everyone to list their players at $1 , I mean, if we're trying to discourage people from listing their players and protect all those poor inexperienced managers, lets just go all the way.Let's just force everyone to list their players at $1 , I mean, if we're trying to discourage people from listing their players and protect all those poor inexperienced managers, lets just go all the way.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 21-11-2017 15:09

[FLUSA]
President

The market is unpredictable, recently there was a player listed for $2M that I wanted to buy and forgot to bid, no one bid on the player so the manager listed him again but at $1, the player ended up selling for $3.8M So, why would a manager in this case have to pay and extra fee because his very reasonable priced player didn't sell?The market is unpredictable, recently there was a player listed for $2M that I wanted to buy and forgot to bid, no one bid on the player so the manager listed him again but at $1, the player ended up selling for $3.8M

So, why would a manager in this case have to pay and extra fee because his very reasonable priced player didn't sell?

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 21-11-2017 16:27

[WCE]
President

The market is very unpredictable yes, we agree one hundred percent. Sometimes it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. The same player is bought one day and then sold for half the money the following week (or less). I recently saw a striker selling for 85 million NOK. The next day, a younger and better striker sold for half of that. That is why baiting can be lucrative. You set the asking price of 2 or 3 or 4 times what the player is actually worth (sometimes even more), and then hope somebody takes the bait. It is textbook "how-to-be-a-complete-douche-on-the-transfer-market". In this example of yours: If a transfer tax is implemented, then the manager should pay, because the player didn't sell initially. Simple. Does he deserve to pay the tax? Yes. The player didn't sell. When setting the asking price, sometimes less is more. It is actually quite a common scenario. I have myself sold players like this, where initially I set the asking price too high. This was my own mistake, which resulted in no bids for the player. I then set the asking price significantly lower, and this resulted in a bidfight where I got more for the player than I initially asked. I'd be happy to pay transfer fee in both cases, and a tax when the player didn't sell. Crew can for example calibrate the profit tax (lower it) to compensate if there is a negative effect that deters managers from listing their players. And/or you can be given a certain amount of failed attempts (2?) per season before the transfer tax kicks in. What I want to see eliminated is the systematic and deliberate misuse of the asking price system, not how Mr Average Joe conducts his affairs.

darkline wrote:

The market is unpredictable, recently there was a player listed for $2M that I wanted to buy and forgot to bid, no one bid on the player so the manager listed him again but at $1, the player ended up selling for $3.8M

The market is very unpredictable yes, we agree one hundred percent. Sometimes it doesn't make any sense whatsoever. The same player is bought one day and then sold for half the money the following week (or less). I recently saw a striker selling for 85 million NOK. The next day, a younger and better striker sold for half of that.

That is why baiting can be lucrative. You set the asking price of 2 or 3 or 4 times what the player is actually worth (sometimes even more), and then hope somebody takes the bait. It is textbook "how-to-be-a-complete-douche-on-the-transfer-market".

In this example of yours:
If a transfer tax is implemented, then the manager should pay, because the player didn't sell initially. Simple. Does he deserve to pay the tax? Yes. The player didn't sell. When setting the asking price, sometimes less is more.

It is actually quite a common scenario. I have myself sold players like this, where initially I set the asking price too high. This was my own mistake, which resulted in no bids for the player. I then set the asking price significantly lower, and this resulted in a bidfight where I got more for the player than I initially asked. I'd be happy to pay transfer fee in both cases, and a tax when the player didn't sell.

Crew can for example calibrate the profit tax (lower it) to compensate if there is a negative effect that deters managers from listing their players. And/or you can be given a certain amount of failed attempts (2?) per season before the transfer tax kicks in.

What I want to see eliminated is the systematic and deliberate misuse of the asking price system, not how Mr Average Joe conducts his affairs.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 21-11-2017 17:06

[FLUSA]
President

I'd go for no limits on how much you can list your player for instead of the current 5X limit and if you don't sell your player after 5 attempts (or 4 or 3), then the system doesn't let you list the player for more than $1 That should cover all bases, managers can try to sell their really good players for what they think they're worth with no limits and at the same time, it prevents abuse and also helps managers that are clueless about how much to ask for their players.

hanzinho wrote:

What I want to see eliminated is the systematic and deliberate misuse of the asking price system, not how Mr Average Joe conducts his affairs.

I'd go for no limits on how much you can list your player for instead of the current 5X limit and if you don't sell your player after 5 attempts (or 4 or 3), then the system doesn't let you list the player for more than $1

That should cover all bases, managers can try to sell their really good players for what they think they're worth with no limits and at the same time, it prevents abuse and also helps managers that are clueless about how much to ask for their players.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By dowopado - 21-11-2017 17:52

[BotP]

I was opposed to the increase of the asking price to begin with for the exact reasons we are debating on this post but it was very clear the majority wanted to increase it to 5X, and even 8X. Those that voted for the increase I believe are the ones that had ill intentions from the beginning. The market has been out of control for a long time due to many factors...notably wealthy players on the market that have insane amount of money to spend and the introductions of the UXX leagues from way back when...not because of the new or inexperience managers that are thriving on meager funds. I could really never understand the need to impose a transaction fee for listing a player on the market but I do believe in the taxing of profits over and above the previous purchase price...or over the value of the player if a new player on the market. As to what the tax percentage should be is up for debate...and in my opinion it should be the only thing that is debatable to help control the market. Weirdly enough...I believe there should have never been a increase in the asking price...it should have been a "ceiling" on the amount that could be made from the market...that is, a player could not be sold for more than 3X, 5X or 8X its MZ value. Anything opposite of a "ceiling" or an enormous tax percentage of profits will just encourage the inflationary trend of the current market.I was opposed to the increase of the asking price to begin with for the exact reasons we are debating on this post but it was very clear the majority wanted to increase it to 5X, and even 8X. Those that voted for the increase I believe are the ones that had ill intentions from the beginning. The market has been out of control for a long time due to many factors...notably wealthy players on the market that have insane amount of money to spend and the introductions of the UXX leagues from way back when...not because of the new or inexperience managers that are thriving on meager funds.

I could really never understand the need to impose a transaction fee for listing a player on the market but I do believe in the taxing of profits over and above the previous purchase price...or over the value of the player if a new player on the market. As to what the tax percentage should be is up for debate...and in my opinion it should be the only thing that is debatable to help control the market.

Weirdly enough...I believe there should have never been a increase in the asking price...it should have been a "ceiling" on the amount that could be made from the market...that is, a player could not be sold for more than 3X, 5X or 8X its MZ value. Anything opposite of a "ceiling" or an enormous tax percentage of profits will just encourage the inflationary trend of the current market.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 21-11-2017 18:17

I was in favor of the x 8 times the value :( Your Current Balance 3 466 180 EUR start's whistling But I'm just a soul whose intentions are good Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstoodI was in favor of the x 8 times the value :(

Your Current Balance 3 466 180 EUR

start's whistling

But I'm just a soul whose intentions are good
Oh Lord, please don't let me be misunderstood

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 21-11-2017 19:50

[FLUSA]
President

Let's go with a real example, I have a 20 y/old with 10 speed/stamina/tackling and an MZ value of $616.000, if my profit is capped at 3x ($1.8M), why would I even put the player on the market? I'm not a big fan of the market, I have money but I rarely expend any I'm not a big fan of selling my future stars neither, but if I could list them from what I'm willing to sell this type of players then I might be tempted to list some.

dowopado wrote:

Weirdly enough...I believe there should have never been a increase in the asking price...it should have been a "ceiling" on the amount that could be made from the market...that is, a player could not be sold for more than 3X, 5X or 8X its MZ value. Anything opposite of a "ceiling" or an enormous tax percentage of profits will just encourage the inflationary trend of the current market.

Let's go with a real example, I have a 20 y/old with 10 speed/stamina/tackling and an MZ value of $616.000, if my profit is capped at 3x ($1.8M), why would I even put the player on the market?

I'm not a big fan of the market, I have money but I rarely expend any I'm not a big fan of selling my future stars neither, but if I could list them from what I'm willing to sell this type of players then I might be tempted to list some.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 21-11-2017 20:13

if you can't increase the outflow of cash from the big teams then increase the possibility of cash flow balancing between all teams (pardon if the economical terms are wrong) if we can't make the rich guys poor (or less rich) by taxing them, let's make the poor teams able to take some money from them by asking big bucks for top quality players this is why you don't want a low cap in asking starting price it's not like we're gonna have a bourgeois revolution in MZ :P and it's not like the first thing being manipulated in MZ (or in every other similar game)if you can't increase the outflow of cash from the big teams
then increase the possibility of cash flow balancing between all teams (pardon if the economical terms are wrong)

if we can't make the rich guys poor (or less rich) by taxing them, let's make the poor teams able to take some money from them by asking big bucks for top quality players

this is why you don't want a low cap in asking starting price

it's not like we're gonna have a bourgeois revolution in MZ :P

and it's not like the first thing being manipulated in MZ (or in every other similar game)

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 21-11-2017 22:35

[WCE]
President

I don't want to see heavier taxation on sale profits, as that would really deter people from selling their prospects. Inflation need to be dealt with, but it should be done by looking at base income like match revenue and tour rewards. Perhaps transfer based wages can be increased aswell (and the transfer fee..). I like part of that suggestion, the bit where you are only allowed to fail x amount of times per player before they are capped at 1 dollar. I'd have it at 2 times instead of 3-5, as that should be sufficient.I don't want to see heavier taxation on sale profits, as that would really deter people from selling their prospects. Inflation need to be dealt with, but it should be done by looking at base income like match revenue and tour rewards. Perhaps transfer based wages can be increased aswell (and the transfer fee..).

darkline wrote:

I'd go for no limits on how much you can list your player for instead of the current 5X limit and if you don't sell your player after 5 attempts (or 4 or 3), then the system doesn't let you list the player for more than $1

That should cover all bases, managers can try to sell their really good players for what they think they're worth with no limits and at the same time, it prevents abuse and also helps managers that are clueless about how much to ask for their players.

I like part of that suggestion, the bit where you are only allowed to fail x amount of times per player before they are capped at 1 dollar. I'd have it at 2 times instead of 3-5, as that should be sufficient.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By dowopado - 21-11-2017 22:43

[BotP]

I just cited examples of limits...it could be 5X which the player could get 3.0M...or 8X which would get 4.9M...to me those are decent prices for the player considering there are chances for low maxings in other skills...that is if the rich with a lot of money want to train the player. But 6, 7 or 10M is ridiculously insane. IMO

darkline wrote:

Let's go with a real example, I have a 20 y/old with 10 speed/stamina/tackling and an MZ value of $616.000, if my profit is capped at 3x ($1.8M), why would I even put the player on the market?

I'm not a big fan of the market, I have money but I rarely expend any I'm not a big fan of selling my future stars neither, but if I could list them from what I'm willing to sell this type of players then I might be tempted to list some.

I just cited examples of limits...it could be 5X which the player could get 3.0M...or 8X which would get 4.9M...to me those are decent prices for the player considering there are chances for low maxings in other skills...that is if the rich with a lot of money want to train the player. But 6, 7 or 10M is ridiculously insane. IMO

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 21-11-2017 23:23

[WCE]
President

Problem with that is that the player valuation system is fundamentally flawed. There are already too many things tangled into it. All elements should be "untangled" and moved away from the flawed valuation system. Only then can it be built up from scratch.

dowopado wrote:

I just cited examples of limits...it could be 5X which the player could get 3.0M...or 8X which would get 4.9M...to me those are decent prices for the player considering there are chances for low maxings in other skills...that is if the rich with a lot of money want to train the player. But 6, 7 or 10M is ridiculously insane. IMO

Problem with that is that the player valuation system is fundamentally flawed.

There are already too many things tangled into it. All elements should be "untangled" and moved away from the flawed valuation system. Only then can it be built up from scratch.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By dowopado - 22-11-2017 00:13

[BotP]

I understand that the valuation system may be part of the problem in comparing MZ values to Market values but still I feel the worth of a player in the Market is way overvalued as well. Thus it becomes a "Catch 22" between the two values...which can be remedy the easiest and quickest. A lot of the reason for the inflated market values over and above the MZ values is due to what...huge accumulations of cash and over-zealous spenders...not necessarily due to the asking price of the player, or inexperienced managers.

hanzinho wrote:

Problem with that is that the player valuation system is fundamentally flawed.

There are already too many things tangled into it. All elements should be "untangled" and moved away from the flawed valuation system. Only then can it be built up from scratch.

I understand that the valuation system may be part of the problem in comparing MZ values to Market values but still I feel the worth of a player in the Market is way overvalued as well. Thus it becomes a "Catch 22" between the two values...which can be remedy the easiest and quickest. A lot of the reason for the inflated market values over and above the MZ values is due to what...huge accumulations of cash and over-zealous spenders...not necessarily due to the asking price of the player, or inexperienced managers.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 22-11-2017 00:56

[WCE]
President

Money in MZ has 0 value unless you spend it (no interest), so you spend it the only place you can, the transfer market. If anything, these over-zealous spenders removes money from the game due to hefty transfer related wages. They are the symptom by highlighting the inflation, they are not the problem. I think the only way to get to the root of the problem, is by looking at the cause of the inflation. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving. Simple mathematics really, and I am sure Crew can easily see this in reports. I wonder if they are using tools to monitor and analyze the situation. The inflation is one of the main reasons why I want to see the transfer fee increased, alongside a taxation if the player isn't sold. We need more money being removed from the game.Money in MZ has 0 value unless you spend it (no interest), so you spend it the only place you can, the transfer market. If anything, these over-zealous spenders removes money from the game due to hefty transfer related wages. They are the symptom by highlighting the inflation, they are not the problem.

I think the only way to get to the root of the problem, is by looking at the cause of the inflation. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving. Simple mathematics really, and I am sure Crew can easily see this in reports. I wonder if they are using tools to monitor and analyze the situation.

The inflation is one of the main reasons why I want to see the transfer fee increased, alongside a taxation if the player isn't sold. We need more money being removed from the game.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By frankiejhoffa - 22-11-2017 05:28

[AUSNZ]

I agree on increasing taxation of a player does not sell - this was my reason for this post . $8100 tax on a non selling player is not realistic . I have read peoples thoughts and now believe a tax of 2.5% on a failed transfer listing . That’s 25k for every million . I think it’s a good figure Hoffa

hanzinho wrote:

Money in MZ has 0 value unless you spend it (no interest), so you spend it the only place you can, the transfer market. If anything, these over-zealous spenders removes money from the game due to hefty transfer related wages. They are the symptom by highlighting the inflation, they are not the problem.

I think the only way to get to the root of the problem, is by looking at the cause of the inflation. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving. Simple mathematics really, and I am sure Crew can easily see this in reports. I wonder if they are using tools to monitor and analyze the situation.

The inflation is one of the main reasons why I want to see the transfer fee increased, alongside a taxation if the player isn't sold. We need more money being removed from the game.

I agree on increasing taxation of a player does not sell - this was my reason for this post . $8100 tax on a non selling player is not realistic . I have read peoples thoughts and now believe a tax of 2.5% on a failed transfer listing .
That’s 25k for every million . I think it’s a good figure

Hoffa

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By dowopado - 22-11-2017 06:46

[BotP]

Finally, we agree on some things: 1. MZ money has no value unless it is spent. 2. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving. 3.We need more money being removed from the game. Now for possible solutions: 1. Increased fees for placing players on the market. 2. Taxation for placing players on the market that are not sold. 3. Increased taxation of profits. 4. Salaries for players to be conducive to market value of player sold above the 5X asking price limit (this may be counter productive to removing green from the system). 5. The reduction of income to inactive accounts. 6. Reduction of Tour handouts of income per tour, or the number of tours. Didn't get into any specifics because those are debatable...was just trying to summarize possibilities to be explored...like the 2.5% proposed by @frankiehoffa in the above post.

hanzinho wrote:

Money in MZ has 0 value unless you spend it (no interest), so you spend it the only place you can, the transfer market. If anything, these over-zealous spenders removes money from the game due to hefty transfer related wages. They are the symptom by highlighting the inflation, they are not the problem.

I think the only way to get to the root of the problem, is by looking at the cause of the inflation. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving. Simple mathematics really, and I am sure Crew can easily see this in reports. I wonder if they are using tools to monitor and analyze the situation.

The inflation is one of the main reasons why I want to see the transfer fee increased, alongside a taxation if the player isn't sold. We need more money being removed from the game.

Finally, we agree on some things:
1. MZ money has no value unless it is spent.
2. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving.
3.We need more money being removed from the game.

Now for possible solutions:
1. Increased fees for placing players on the market.
2. Taxation for placing players on the market that are not sold.
3. Increased taxation of profits.
4. Salaries for players to be conducive to market value of player sold above the 5X asking price limit (this may be counter productive to removing green from the system).
5. The reduction of income to inactive accounts.
6. Reduction of Tour handouts of income per tour, or the number of tours.

Didn't get into any specifics because those are debatable...was just trying to summarize possibilities to be explored...like the 2.5% proposed by @frankiehoffa in the above post.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 22-11-2017 06:57

[FLUSA]
President

It's more complex, not everyone gets too much money, mostly the managers that get too much money are the ones with only Uxx teams and no senior players, they buy young players, sell them at 24 y/old (or 19 or 22 depending on the Uxx competitions the manager plays) and usually end up making a profit. They have more money for multiple reasons, a Uxx cup produces the same income as a senior cup, but there are 2 Uxx cups for every senior cup. A senior team loses money due to retirements & deteriorations, you buy a player at 21 y/old and sell him at 24 y/old and chances are you'll make a profit, you buy a 27 y/old player and sell him at 29 y/old and you lose money, sell him at 30+ and you'll lose even more money, extend the player's career and you have too expend more money for a player you won't be able to sell.... So basically, a lot of senior teams struggle with money & an increasingly expensive market and the way they keep afloat is by selling some of their younger players to those managers that can pay them... it's a vicious circle that I'm not sure can be broken, trying to fix this now might break something else.

dowopado wrote:

Finally, we agree on some things:
1. MZ money has no value unless it is spent.
2. There is too much money coming into the game, and not enough of the green is leaving.
3.We need more money being removed from the game.

It's more complex, not everyone gets too much money, mostly the managers that get too much money are the ones with only Uxx teams and no senior players, they buy young players, sell them at 24 y/old (or 19 or 22 depending on the Uxx competitions the manager plays) and usually end up making a profit.

They have more money for multiple reasons, a Uxx cup produces the same income as a senior cup, but there are 2 Uxx cups for every senior cup. A senior team loses money due to retirements & deteriorations, you buy a player at 21 y/old and sell him at 24 y/old and chances are you'll make a profit, you buy a 27 y/old player and sell him at 29 y/old and you lose money, sell him at 30+ and you'll lose even more money, extend the player's career and you have too expend more money for a player you won't be able to sell....

So basically, a lot of senior teams struggle with money & an increasingly expensive market and the way they keep afloat is by selling some of their younger players to those managers that can pay them... it's a vicious circle that I'm not sure can be broken, trying to fix this now might break something else.

Edited: 22-11-2017 06:59
Total edits: 1

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 22-11-2017 14:28

[WCE]
President

A fair point. I agree that it is very lucrative only having U-xx teams. When your done with your players, you sell them with a big profit (no retirements here). Eventually when you have made enough money, you start your senior-team endeavor with a sick amount of money. This is actually a strategy I am encouraging Norwegian teams to apply if they want to "conquer" the world. You can't easily break this chain, and it is not desirable to break it either. This is how you "lure" people into the game. Having a competitive U18/U21/U23-team while simultaneously making money is the best motivation to keep playing this game. If I can get a new Norwegian user to apply this strategy, then its next to guaranteed he will stick around and be an asset to our little community. This strategy has always been lucrative. It is only in the recent seasons we have seen transfer prices skyrocket (a year or so?), so there are other factors at play here aswell. I'd be happy to see a decrease in revenue for cup matches though, Uxx ones in particular. Here are my list of suggestion from the top of my head: * Reduce the income in Uxx-cup matches. * Sponsorhip income only to teams that have atleast a full senior team (11 players 24 yo or older). This should be done gradually, of course. * Increase the transfer fee. * Taxation on players not being sold. * Reduce the amount you receive in the tour handouts. Basically, the amount you receive should be dependent on a report/tool Crew use to analyze the financial situation across all teams. Therefor act as a calibrator for getting things into "balance". Notice how I keep bring up transfer fee and taxation on players not being sold. I am doing my best to stay within the boundaries of the thread ;) Above suggestions will hurt Uxx teams the most, without paralyzing them financially. You don't want a situation where teams end up getting bankrupt.

darkline wrote:

It's more complex, not everyone gets too much money, mostly the managers that get too much money are the ones with only Uxx teams and no senior players, they buy young players, sell them at 24 y/old (or 19 or 22 depending on the Uxx competitions the manager plays) and usually end up making a profit.

They have more money for multiple reasons, a Uxx cup produces the same income as a senior cup, but there are 2 Uxx cups for every senior cup. A senior team loses money due to retirements & deteriorations, you buy a player at 21 y/old and sell him at 24 y/old and chances are you'll make a profit, you buy a 27 y/old player and sell him at 29 y/old and you lose money, sell him at 30+ and you'll lose even more money, extend the player's career and you have too expend more money for a player you won't be able to sell....

So basically, a lot of senior teams struggle with money & an increasingly expensive market and the way they keep afloat is by selling some of their younger players to those managers that can pay them... it's a vicious circle that I'm not sure can be broken, trying to fix this now might break something else.

A fair point. I agree that it is very lucrative only having U-xx teams. When your done with your players, you sell them with a big profit (no retirements here). Eventually when you have made enough money, you start your senior-team endeavor with a sick amount of money. This is actually a strategy I am encouraging Norwegian teams to apply if they want to "conquer" the world.

You can't easily break this chain, and it is not desirable to break it either. This is how you "lure" people into the game. Having a competitive U18/U21/U23-team while simultaneously making money is the best motivation to keep playing this game. If I can get a new Norwegian user to apply this strategy, then its next to guaranteed he will stick around and be an asset to our little community.

This strategy has always been lucrative.
It is only in the recent seasons we have seen transfer prices skyrocket (a year or so?), so there are other factors at play here aswell. I'd be happy to see a decrease in revenue for cup matches though, Uxx ones in particular.

Here are my list of suggestion from the top of my head:
* Reduce the income in Uxx-cup matches.
* Sponsorhip income only to teams that have atleast a full senior team (11 players 24 yo or older). This should be done gradually, of course.
* Increase the transfer fee.
* Taxation on players not being sold.
* Reduce the amount you receive in the tour handouts. Basically, the amount you receive should be dependent on a report/tool Crew use to analyze the financial situation across all teams. Therefor act as a calibrator for getting things into "balance".

Notice how I keep bring up transfer fee and taxation on players not being sold. I am doing my best to stay within the boundaries of the thread ;) Above suggestions will hurt Uxx teams the most, without paralyzing them financially. You don't want a situation where teams end up getting bankrupt.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By civilu - 22-11-2017 15:07

[RAF]
President

[b]The unjustice/unbalance created between Uxx teams and O24 teams in terms of finances is simply staggering![/b] It's unconcevable to have a team play in a country's Top League win as much as a team playing in a Uxx Top League. I admit there should be rewards but nowhere near what one gets at senior top level. As I also pointed out not long ago, [b]it is imperious that Crew works on an updated valuation system for players![/b] Otherwise we may find ourselves, changing/creating rules depending on player value, doing more injustice to teams which otherwise might not suffer that much. Thirdly, [b]the problem is not tour handouts but the lack of taxation on money in the club[/b], which is neither invested in players nor used in any way (transfers). I would vote yes with two hands up for a tax of x% on all team money exceeding 5 mil. EUR on any given Saturday, with an increased percentile the more money the team has and keeps: e.g. weekly 1% for <5M (50k), 1,5% for 5-10M (max of 150k), 2% for >10M euro (min 200k). To deter money hoarding you either create advantages for investments or impose taxes - it's a basic rule also in life.The unjustice/unbalance created between Uxx teams and O24 teams in terms of finances is simply staggering! It's unconcevable to have a team play in a country's Top League win as much as a team playing in a Uxx Top League. I admit there should be rewards but nowhere near what one gets at senior top level.

As I also pointed out not long ago, it is imperious that Crew works on an updated valuation system for players! Otherwise we may find ourselves, changing/creating rules depending on player value, doing more injustice to teams which otherwise might not suffer that much.

Thirdly, the problem is not tour handouts but the lack of taxation on money in the club, which is neither invested in players nor used in any way (transfers). I would vote yes with two hands up for a tax of x% on all team money exceeding 5 mil. EUR on any given Saturday, with an increased percentile the more money the team has and keeps: e.g. weekly 1% for <5M (50k), 1,5% for 5-10M (max of 150k), 2% for >10M euro (min 200k). To deter money hoarding you either create advantages for investments or impose taxes - it's a basic rule also in life.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 22-11-2017 16:11

[WCE]
President

I agree with all above. I hate the idea of taxes on team money, but it might be a necessary evil. There shouldn't be a limit as to when tax kicks in, since you otherwise will have teams manipulating their finances so that they always stay lower than 5 or 10 million euro when the tax is being run. But the less club money, the less percentage tax obviously.

civilu wrote:

The unjustice/unbalance created between Uxx teams and O24 teams in terms of finances is simply staggering! It's unconcevable to have a team play in a country's Top League win as much as a team playing in a Uxx Top League. I admit there should be rewards but nowhere near what one gets at senior top level.

As I also pointed out not long ago, it is imperious that Crew works on an updated valuation system for players! Otherwise we may find ourselves, changing/creating rules depending on player value, doing more injustice to teams which otherwise might not suffer that much.

Thirdly, the problem is not tour handouts but the lack of taxation on money in the club, which is neither invested in players nor used in any way (transfers). I would vote yes with two hands up for a tax of x% on all team money exceeding 5 mil. EUR on any given Saturday, with an increased percentile the more money the team has and keeps: e.g. weekly 1% for <5M (50k), 1,5% for 5-10M (max of 150k), 2% for >10M euro (min 200k). To deter money hoarding you either create advantages for investments or impose taxes - it's a basic rule also in life.

I agree with all above.

I hate the idea of taxes on team money, but it might be a necessary evil.

There shouldn't be a limit as to when tax kicks in, since you otherwise will have teams manipulating their finances so that they always stay lower than 5 or 10 million euro when the tax is being run. But the less club money, the less percentage tax obviously.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 22-11-2017 16:13

[WCE]
President

Friendly advice though, you might become as popular as "Jean-Marc Bosman" if this tax is implemented. Civilu, the man who took everybody's money.Friendly advice though, you might become as popular as "Jean-Marc Bosman" if this tax is implemented.

Civilu, the man who took everybody's money.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 22-11-2017 16:34

[FLUSA]
President

I have about $22M and around 70 players in total, I expend a lot of money in salaries & training camps, I don't make extravagant bids, why should I pay a tax because other teams have too much money since they don't even have a senior team?I have about $22M and around 70 players in total, I expend a lot of money in salaries & training camps, I don't make extravagant bids, why should I pay a tax because other teams have too much money since they don't even have a senior team?

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By civilu - 22-11-2017 16:45

[RAF]
President

I am and remain a liberal in thinking and as attorney it does seem somewhat awkward to suggest implementing leftist measures (higher income taxes and proper distribution of money) yet I really believe without it the game would only spiral towards having less and less teams with more and more money.

hanzinho wrote:

Friendly advice though, you might become as popular as "Jean-Marc Bosman" if this tax is implemented.

Civilu, the man who took everybody's money.

I am and remain a liberal in thinking and as attorney it does seem somewhat awkward to suggest implementing leftist measures (higher income taxes and proper distribution of money) yet I really believe without it the game would only spiral towards having less and less teams with more and more money.

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By hanzinho - 22-11-2017 16:54

[WCE]
President

Because everybody else will be paying...

darkline wrote:

I have about $22M and around 70 players in total, I expend a lot of money in salaries & training camps, I don't make extravagant bids, why should I pay a tax because other teams have too much money since they don't even have a senior team?

Because everybody else will be paying...

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By aldebaran - 22-11-2017 17:05

you could always tax profit per season and leave current bank balances as they areyou could always tax profit per season and leave current bank balances as they are

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 22-11-2017 17:07

[FLUSA]
President

And that's a good reason because...?? If they tax 90% of any money over $1 not expend every week, you'll be alright with it because everyone else will be paying?

hanzinho wrote:

Because everybody else will be paying...

And that's a good reason because...?? If they tax 90% of any money over $1 not expend every week, you'll be alright with it because everyone else will be paying?

Re: Exorbitant transfer price demands

By darkline - 22-11-2017 17:11

[FLUSA]
President

You could tax profit per season over $5M and also add a tax for teams without eleven O24 players, that'll be ok.

aldebaran wrote:

you could always tax profit per season and leave current bank balances as they are

You could tax profit per season over $5M and also add a tax for teams without eleven O24 players, that'll be ok.

 

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