Football » English » Suggestions/Improvements

New ideas for Loyal Players

By lanfa - 28-04-2016 13:38

[MZ]

In my opinion, the loyal players are not good now. They are too determined by luck. If you have a lot of luck comes a champion who is worth millions, if you have bad luck (and often is) you give up so many bonuses for not getting anything concrete. But the worst aspect is that every loyal player who we add in the team, creates damage to the market because there are fewer trades. I therefore propose two solutions: the first is more soft, the second is more radical. 1) Remove loyal players to new teams. They don’t need them because now they get good players; to have 5 loyal players leads to make limited use of the market. Okay to keep them as an alternative to the bonus but I would recommend to provide a third option for those who already have one loyal player, so as to make it a good choice for everyone. There should be an intermediate bonus gain between those who take 0 loyal players and who takes two loyal players. Or 2) Revise completely loyal players! Loyal players should not come from outside but they should be the players that we have in our team for the longest time. For example, after 8-10 seasons in the same team, some become loyal players. Not all, but some chosen at random (or connected to some parameter). The manager may choose to make them come loyal or not and there may be a limit to the maximum number of loyal players for each team (as now). The benefit would be the reduced salary by 20-30% compared to normal players. The disadvantage is you can’t sell them (as now). In this way, it would also be more logical to call them "loyal players" since you are in the team for a long (instead of getting it from nothing as now). No new players, where luck is decisive, they are our players! The youth players can be loyal players between 23 to 25 years in order to reward our consistency in keeping them. The young senior (19-23 years), bought and then kept on the same team, become loyal players aged between 26-28 years to 30-32 years. So it becomes even more advantageous to keep the over 28 who deteriorate, it would be an incentive and also would have an advantage over those players (given that for many users the players deteriorate also represent a problem of costs to pay for physical therapists). What do you think?In my opinion, the loyal players are not good now. They are too determined by luck. If you have a lot of luck comes a champion who is worth millions, if you have bad luck (and often is) you give up so many bonuses for not getting anything concrete. But the worst aspect is that every loyal player who we add in the team, creates damage to the market because there are fewer trades. I therefore propose two solutions: the first is more soft, the second is more radical.

1) Remove loyal players to new teams. They don’t need them because now they get good players; to have 5 loyal players leads to make limited use of the market.
Okay to keep them as an alternative to the bonus but I would recommend to provide a third option for those who already have one loyal player, so as to make it a good choice for everyone. There should be an intermediate bonus gain between those who take 0 loyal players and who takes two loyal players.

Or

2) Revise completely loyal players! Loyal players should not come from outside but they should be the players that we have in our team for the longest time. For example, after 8-10 seasons in the same team, some become loyal players. Not all, but some chosen at random (or connected to some parameter).
The manager may choose to make them come loyal or not and there may be a limit to the maximum number of loyal players for each team (as now). The benefit would be the reduced salary by 20-30% compared to normal players. The disadvantage is you can’t sell them (as now).
In this way, it would also be more logical to call them "loyal players" since you are in the team for a long (instead of getting it from nothing as now). No new players, where luck is decisive, they are our players! The youth players can be loyal players between 23 to 25 years in order to reward our consistency in keeping them.
The young senior (19-23 years), bought and then kept on the same team, become loyal players aged between 26-28 years to 30-32 years.

So it becomes even more advantageous to keep the over 28 who deteriorate, it would be an incentive and also would have an advantage over those players (given that for many users the players deteriorate also represent a problem of costs to pay for physical therapists). What do you think?

 

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Re: New ideas for Loyal Players

By held85 - 29-04-2016 15:34

2nd idea is quite good. Loyal players atm doesn't make much sense, since we're in training 2.0.2nd idea is quite good. Loyal players atm doesn't make much sense, since we're in training 2.0.

Re: New ideas for Loyal Players

By derekmcc - 30-04-2016 13:03

I agree - the 2nd option is a good idea. At the minute it is too risky to choose loyal players. With your idea at least you know what you are getting and therefore making the bonus worthwhile.I agree - the 2nd option is a good idea. At the minute it is too risky to choose loyal players. With your idea at least you know what you are getting and therefore making the bonus worthwhile.

Re: New ideas for Loyal Players

By matttombstone - 01-05-2016 17:57

[BotP]

I somewhat disagree, and allow me to explain why. The salary bonus is a good thing, a reduction in salary means small savings, but is a small saving worth it? If you could save £1,000 off a players salary that's £13,000 over a season, £130,000 over ten seasons. However, in order to get that saving you forfeit the right to sell him, and what if he's worth £1,000,000? I can't see many people taking up that option - I wouldn't. My suggestion. Loyal players start as youths who are aged 13. They turn up at the same standard as 15 year old youths, however for 2 seasons they can't play any matches that you can see. For 2 seasons you can't see the players skills, but you can choose where to train him. You only get a weekly report from your U15 coach on how he's progressing with him giving you comments that show he's training fast, slow or okay or whether he's showing no signs of improvement. The U15 coach over the season would try him in different positions and at the end of the season would report where he's been the most effective. This would indicate a few things - his skill levels and where he'd be best suited. After 2 seasons he becomes 15 (shows as 16) and promotes to your U18 youths, taking no youth spot and costing slightly less than your average youth. By this time, provided training has been well done he would be superior to any 18 year old youth. He would be a loyal player however and would never be sold. From here on he trains like a normal youth but has the added advantage of 2 extra seasons training with slightly faster speeds. Even a 13 year old youth who turned up with 9 skill balls total would be able to promote at 15 with around 25 - 30 skill balls. The catch would be that a U15 loyal youth would not be able to progress beyond 5 in any skill, so the best of the best would be able to graduate to the U18 youth squad with 4-5 skills at 5 balls. The loyal player would never be able to be sold however, as with today. It just adds a new dynamic to the game, introduces a new, interesting feature to the game and puts a spin on already active features.I somewhat disagree, and allow me to explain why.

The salary bonus is a good thing, a reduction in salary means small savings, but is a small saving worth it? If you could save £1,000 off a players salary that's £13,000 over a season, £130,000 over ten seasons. However, in order to get that saving you forfeit the right to sell him, and what if he's worth £1,000,000? I can't see many people taking up that option - I wouldn't.

My suggestion.

Loyal players start as youths who are aged 13. They turn up at the same standard as 15 year old youths, however for 2 seasons they can't play any matches that you can see. For 2 seasons you can't see the players skills, but you can choose where to train him. You only get a weekly report from your U15 coach on how he's progressing with him giving you comments that show he's training fast, slow or okay or whether he's showing no signs of improvement. The U15 coach over the season would try him in different positions and at the end of the season would report where he's been the most effective. This would indicate a few things - his skill levels and where he'd be best suited.

After 2 seasons he becomes 15 (shows as 16) and promotes to your U18 youths, taking no youth spot and costing slightly less than your average youth. By this time, provided training has been well done he would be superior to any 18 year old youth. He would be a loyal player however and would never be sold. From here on he trains like a normal youth but has the added advantage of 2 extra seasons training with slightly faster speeds. Even a 13 year old youth who turned up with 9 skill balls total would be able to promote at 15 with around 25 - 30 skill balls. The catch would be that a U15 loyal youth would not be able to progress beyond 5 in any skill, so the best of the best would be able to graduate to the U18 youth squad with 4-5 skills at 5 balls.

The loyal player would never be able to be sold however, as with today. It just adds a new dynamic to the game, introduces a new, interesting feature to the game and puts a spin on already active features.

Re: New ideas for Loyal Players

By matttombstone - 01-05-2016 18:01

[BotP]

Just to add to this bit [i]The catch would be that a U15 loyal youth would not be able to progress beyond 5 in any skill, so the best of the best would be able to graduate to the U18 youth squad with 4-5 skills at 5 balls. [/i] It doesn't mean the player is maxed, it's a temporary maxing as the U15 team wouldn't have the coaches or facility to progress him any further. There, of course, would be a chance he's maxed at 5 in that skill level and a fee can be paid for a report on his progress which shows his best training skills (i.e. the 3 skills a YTC or a youth exchange report would show) and any maxing he may have picked up. This youth would also not be able to be exchanged and he'd have a lower probability of maxing early compared to standard youths.Just to add to this bit The catch would be that a U15 loyal youth would not be able to progress beyond 5 in any skill, so the best of the best would be able to graduate to the U18 youth squad with 4-5 skills at 5 balls.


It doesn't mean the player is maxed, it's a temporary maxing as the U15 team wouldn't have the coaches or facility to progress him any further. There, of course, would be a chance he's maxed at 5 in that skill level and a fee can be paid for a report on his progress which shows his best training skills (i.e. the 3 skills a YTC or a youth exchange report would show) and any maxing he may have picked up. This youth would also not be able to be exchanged and he'd have a lower probability of maxing early compared to standard youths.

Ri: New ideas for Loyal Players

By lanfa - 03-05-2016 09:29

[MZ]

Thank you all for the answers! @matttombstone: I have spoken of 20-30% less salary, so it should be about twice what you considered and %, that I mentioned, is hypothetical, it can be increased if needed. The important thing is that you don't exaggerate. The point is not to have a higher gain to the sale value! If you want to sell the player does not make loyal! But there are players that are kept until retirement or until they become useless (for deterioration), it's with them that you have advantages and they will be loyal players. (The old and deteriorated players hardly sell them at a good price) Then it's up to the skill of the manager to take this opportunity. It must not be more convenient the savings that immediate sale. It is obvious that if you sell a great complete player at 25-26 years, he will be worth far more than the savings you get with my proposal, but often a good player is taking a long time, not sold. If you plan to sell it, you will not be him to be loyal player. With regard to your suggestion I observe you introduce many new aspects: - Players even younger - New coaches for these young - New growth mechanisms with particular restrictions It therefore becomes a more complicated proposal to apply, with so many new elements, so it is more difficult to understand the consequences it will have on the rest of the game! What I see is that you go to anticipate in some way the lives of players and you introduce some SUPER young players who go to completely distort the youth competitions and more. Before making changes so important, I would reason well about the consequences.Thank you all for the answers!

@matttombstone: I have spoken of 20-30% less salary, so it should be about twice what you considered and %, that I mentioned, is hypothetical, it can be increased if needed. The important thing is that you don't exaggerate.

The point is not to have a higher gain to the sale value! If you want to sell the player does not make loyal! But there are players that are kept until retirement or until they become useless (for deterioration), it's with them that you have advantages and they will be loyal players. (The old and deteriorated players hardly sell them at a good price)

Then it's up to the skill of the manager to take this opportunity. It must not be more convenient the savings that immediate sale. It is obvious that if you sell a great complete player at 25-26 years, he will be worth far more than the savings you get with my proposal, but often a good player is taking a long time, not sold. If you plan to sell it, you will not be him to be loyal player.


With regard to your suggestion I observe you introduce many new aspects:
- Players even younger
- New coaches for these young
- New growth mechanisms with particular restrictions

It therefore becomes a more complicated proposal to apply, with so many new elements, so it is more difficult to understand the consequences it will have on the rest of the game! What I see is that you go to anticipate in some way the lives of players and you introduce some SUPER young players who go to completely distort the youth competitions and more.
Before making changes so important, I would reason well about the consequences.

Re: New ideas for Loyal Players

By matttombstone - 04-05-2016 21:55

[BotP]

Even at double it would be £260k savings over 10 seasons. I do understand your point though about certain players you will always keep until they retire, certain people may use that aspect, I just wouldn't, £26k a season is next to nothing really, I make £21k from a friendly match, so for me personally (and this is my opinion and my course of action, others may have different opinions and courses of action, let me just stress this is personal preference, not fact) I wouldn't want to eliminate the possibility of selling the player just to save £26k a season. I see your point about the enhanced youth, but everyone would be limited to just 2-3 youths, no more than that, and you couldn't bring in another until you dismissed that youth or he retired. Perhaps not make him superior to an 18 year old youth but perhaps at 15 make him the same standard of an average 3rd year youth who's been moved around a bit. Remember, no 15 year old loyal youth would have more than 5 in any skill and may only have 2 or 3 skills which have gone to those levels. It is suggesting a new system and element. There'll be no new coaches, imagine these coaches already exist and currently supply you your U18 youths from an imaginary U15 team you currently have. Essentially all that would be introduced is a few lines of text indicating how he's doing. It could simply be something like... [i]Good morning boss, Just an update on John Doe's progress this week. During his matches this is what I have noted. In a cup match he played midfield and had an AVERAGE game In the league match he played in defence and had an EXCELLENT game During training this is what I have noticed. He SHOWED IMPROVEMENT in speed (would suggest a ball gained) He trained VERY POOR in stamina (Suggests slow training speed or near a maxing/U15 of 5 ball maxing) We have TRIED to teach him passing but we don't have the facilities to improve it anymore (Suggests maxing/5 ball limit) He trained GOOD in shooting (Suggests above average training speed) He trained AVERAGE in tackling (Suggests normal training speed) He trained POOR in Aerial Passing (Suggests below average training speed) He trained EXCELLENT in Set Piece (Suggests very fast training) I'll keep an eye on him and let you know this weeks progress next Monday boss. Good luck this week![/i] That's all the "Coach" would be. Training and match performance would have words to indicate his performance during training and matches, you'd have Excellent, Good, Average, Poor, Very poor, No improvement (Tried) and Improvement and those you would gauge on how the player is developing and playing. There would be nothing but a weekly coach report from him, you wouldn't see him and he wouldn't add to your weekly costs. The player essentially has his skills hidden until he turns 15 and the coach gives you gauges on how he's training. When he promotes you get a final coach report that shows you the 3 areas he has potential in, just like Youth Training Camp does now. I can't see it taking a lot of coding to do that. You add a younger age, you set maximum ball values to 5, you hide the ball values, you hide the training speed charts in training report and convert them into words and you set it to no training report, only a weekly summary in words each week. It would just be a fun aspect, you get a better trained youth at the end of it and a player who's developed a bit faster and has a little extra potential, no 10 speed, 10 stamina, 10 PI, 10 passing, 10 shooting, 10 heading, 10 ball control at the age of 21, that would be impossible to achieve even with no maxings. But a 21 year old loyal youth who's been TC'ed each season since he became 15 would be the same quality of a 24/25 year old who's been TC'ed since 15. You can't sell him, you have a maximum of two and can't get any new ones until you sack him or he retires. Just my suggestion really, thought it'd add a new interesting dynamic than be given loyal players as they are now.

lanfa wrote:

Thank you all for the answers!

@matttombstone: I have spoken of 20-30% less salary, so it should be about twice what you considered and %, that I mentioned, is hypothetical, it can be increased if needed. The important thing is that you don't exaggerate.

The point is not to have a higher gain to the sale value! If you want to sell the player does not make loyal! But there are players that are kept until retirement or until they become useless (for deterioration), it's with them that you have advantages and they will be loyal players. (The old and deteriorated players hardly sell them at a good price)

Then it's up to the skill of the manager to take this opportunity. It must not be more convenient the savings that immediate sale. It is obvious that if you sell a great complete player at 25-26 years, he will be worth far more than the savings you get with my proposal, but often a good player is taking a long time, not sold. If you plan to sell it, you will not be him to be loyal player.


With regard to your suggestion I observe you introduce many new aspects:
- Players even younger
- New coaches for these young
- New growth mechanisms with particular restrictions

It therefore becomes a more complicated proposal to apply, with so many new elements, so it is more difficult to understand the consequences it will have on the rest of the game! What I see is that you go to anticipate in some way the lives of players and you introduce some SUPER young players who go to completely distort the youth competitions and more.
Before making changes so important, I would reason well about the consequences.

Even at double it would be £260k savings over 10 seasons. I do understand your point though about certain players you will always keep until they retire, certain people may use that aspect, I just wouldn't, £26k a season is next to nothing really, I make £21k from a friendly match, so for me personally (and this is my opinion and my course of action, others may have different opinions and courses of action, let me just stress this is personal preference, not fact) I wouldn't want to eliminate the possibility of selling the player just to save £26k a season.

I see your point about the enhanced youth, but everyone would be limited to just 2-3 youths, no more than that, and you couldn't bring in another until you dismissed that youth or he retired. Perhaps not make him superior to an 18 year old youth but perhaps at 15 make him the same standard of an average 3rd year youth who's been moved around a bit. Remember, no 15 year old loyal youth would have more than 5 in any skill and may only have 2 or 3 skills which have gone to those levels.

It is suggesting a new system and element. There'll be no new coaches, imagine these coaches already exist and currently supply you your U18 youths from an imaginary U15 team you currently have. Essentially all that would be introduced is a few lines of text indicating how he's doing. It could simply be something like...

Good morning boss,

Just an update on John Doe's progress this week. During his matches this is what I have noted.

In a cup match he played midfield and had an AVERAGE game
In the league match he played in defence and had an EXCELLENT game

During training this is what I have noticed.

He SHOWED IMPROVEMENT in speed (would suggest a ball gained)
He trained VERY POOR in stamina (Suggests slow training speed or near a maxing/U15 of 5 ball maxing)
We have TRIED to teach him passing but we don't have the facilities to improve it anymore (Suggests maxing/5 ball limit)
He trained GOOD in shooting (Suggests above average training speed)
He trained AVERAGE in tackling (Suggests normal training speed)
He trained POOR in Aerial Passing (Suggests below average training speed)
He trained EXCELLENT in Set Piece (Suggests very fast training)

I'll keep an eye on him and let you know this weeks progress next Monday boss. Good luck this week!

That's all the "Coach" would be. Training and match performance would have words to indicate his performance during training and matches, you'd have Excellent, Good, Average, Poor, Very poor, No improvement (Tried) and Improvement and those you would gauge on how the player is developing and playing. There would be nothing but a weekly coach report from him, you wouldn't see him and he wouldn't add to your weekly costs.

The player essentially has his skills hidden until he turns 15 and the coach gives you gauges on how he's training. When he promotes you get a final coach report that shows you the 3 areas he has potential in, just like Youth Training Camp does now.

I can't see it taking a lot of coding to do that. You add a younger age, you set maximum ball values to 5, you hide the ball values, you hide the training speed charts in training report and convert them into words and you set it to no training report, only a weekly summary in words each week.

It would just be a fun aspect, you get a better trained youth at the end of it and a player who's developed a bit faster and has a little extra potential, no 10 speed, 10 stamina, 10 PI, 10 passing, 10 shooting, 10 heading, 10 ball control at the age of 21, that would be impossible to achieve even with no maxings. But a 21 year old loyal youth who's been TC'ed each season since he became 15 would be the same quality of a 24/25 year old who's been TC'ed since 15. You can't sell him, you have a maximum of two and can't get any new ones until you sack him or he retires.

Just my suggestion really, thought it'd add a new interesting dynamic than be given loyal players as they are now.

 

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