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Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 10:45
Does the form of a player 'ACTUALLY' make any significant difference (in a match)? and aemi, no jokes this time please. coz im really serious and pissed today (and have been so for the last many days) :S:$
Views: 161 Posts: 29
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 22-03-2017 16:38Form is probably one of the key elements for a player to perform at his optimum skill capabilities...that is, being match fit and at 9/10 balls. So, yes it makes a significant difference.
The significant difference may be small from 8 to 9, or 7 to 8...but if a player is overplayed or underplayed at 6, 7, or 8 then the difference is much larger.
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 20:50
dowopado wrote:Form is probably one of the key elements for a player to perform at his optimum skill capabilities
dowopado wrote:I have never played with players at 0 to 3 form but I would assume it would increase my chances of losing astronomically against a team with much better form.
well mate, i was told the same and i too am of the same opinion as you are regarding form....oh sorry, did i say ''i'm on'' ? :S tsk tsk..so bad on my part. :S:( well, i too 'WAS' of the same opinion, but i'm not anymore :) and i would advice you to do the same, coz looking at those words of yours (which i quoted above), the SIM must be having a hearty laugh ;):D
You see, looking at my many recent results, its hard to say that the form thing ACTUALLY exists . in fact, this applies not only for my recent results, but for some mid-season matches too. let me make myself more clear -
Match 1 - http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&tid=1109724&mid=903794183
just-concluded match. i lost 8-0. almost none of that team's players were even close to match fit. all had 0 form, apart from 2-3 who had 6. also, that team wasnt even far more better than mine. last season i would lose 1-0 to him with a slightly better team of mine (not all match fit) and with the same team of his (all match fir). and this time i lose 8-0. and this despite all my players having 9 form :D so much for saying ''I have never played with players at 0 to 3 form but I would assume it would increase my chances of losing astronomically against a team with much better form.'' :D;)
and oh, this is just the tip of the iceberg ;) wait until u watch this match - http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&mid=903794069 . match against the same team, but this was the first leg of our league fixture. he played a WAY DAMN NOOBY team (dont judge his team for that match looking at their current values, coz at that time they were WAY WORSE than what they are now....from what i remember not even one of them had a decent 8 in their respective main skills). and still i lost :) (Cont.)
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 21:00
Match 2 - http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&tid=1109724&mid=903794179,
An even greater disappointment. i did win, but LUCKILY. in fact, i lost ALL (except a single draw) my 'Challenge' matches i had played with him. this despite my players having 9 form while his having 0 (ALMOST ALL 0) ;)even the fact that i should lose one match against him would be a BIG JOKE. and here i lose all Challenge matches. cool ! :D and regarding this match, i LUCKILY won. in fact, looking at the stats, his was the better team. but unluckily for him the SIM 'wanted me to win' (a phenomenon i will be explaining soon) and hence i won. also, his team aint even better than mine, and that makes me wonder if he was even 'eligible' to draw with me, given his and my team's players and their respective forms :D (Cont.)
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 21:17
if anyone thought i've been done injustice with, the best part's yet to come !!!!! :D;) Match 3 - http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&tid=1109724&mid=918982152
Words arent enough to describe this match. his keeper - keeping 2 form 3. half his team had youth (some again with form 5 or lesser). my strikers all had shooting 9+ with 2 having 10. had 7 SOTs, and NONE of them (cant believe i'm even having to say something like this :(:D) went in. the opposite team's WORLD CLASS goalie with a MAGNIFICENT 3 form and ALL THE MORE MAGNIFICENT 3 keeping stopped 7 damn shots of players with 9-10 shooting :D even calling this joke would be an understatement ;) wouldnt be surprised if this keeper went on to play for FC Barcelona :D
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 21:31
just 2 more things left. first of all, regarding the earlier mentioned 'SIM wanted me to win phenomena' . well, from what i've noticed in the past few days, in many matches i see a side winning JUST FOR THE SAKE OF IT. in a football forum thread named 'Winning problem', a user has complained no winning against some particular teams. i have a similar complain. in our league too, there are 2 teams like this. and they are none other than the ones i mentioned in Matches 1&2. not that these 2 always win, but it takes a VERY GOOD (far better than them) team to beat them. and this despite the fact that the players of that team have very bad form. for eg, i lost by 5-6 goals to one of the top teams. and this guy loses just 4-2 DESPITE having a team which should have received a minimum 6-7 goal drubbing. and as i said, its the case with every team they play. im sorry but i'll be brutally honest on this - it makes me feel like they are barca and the SIM is UEFA :(
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 22:01
and now last but not the least. first of all, i have a very good reason for venting so much frustration. today's match which i lost cost me a Top 3 finish in my country's top league (the UNDESERVED 1-0 loss to that guy in midseason too is responsible for this missed out Top 3 chance). next, that loss against that nooby Chinese team denied me a chance to qualify my Group in that particular Official Cup. both of this were VERY FRUSTRATING, to say the least. maybe i shouldnt have vent my frustration and lashed out like this. maybe this conduct of mine was unbecoming of an xA. but what i've been going through is much worse than that. the way the sim's been treating me, i'd even thought of quitting for once. coz it just doesnt stop. game after game i see outrageous results ! so, the form thing is now a hoax to me as is Global Warming to Trump (though i wouldnt blame the Chinese for the form thing ;):D ) i guess the SIM should either be fixed or else we should atleast have a 'What it means to get simmed' topic in the Manual with stuff like ''Lost outrageously ? Dont worry, you just had the pleasure of being simmed ;):D '' so that the managers atleast get some much needed consolation :( to conclude, i would just like to define my current relationship with the SIM by saying - Even the CNN and Trump share a better relationship.....:(;(
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 22:12
advise you*.....and sorry for all the other (if there are..which im not correcting lol) spelling errors lol , its late here and i can hardly see a thing :P
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 22-03-2017 22:20
''MAGNIFICENT 3 form and ALL THE MORE MAGNIFICENT 3 keeping''....if you thought 3 keeping was too less for the saves he made, let me add to your shock ;) one correction here - chap had only 2 keeping :D
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 23-03-2017 03:56dowopado wrote:Form is probably one of the key elements for a player to perform at his optimum skill capabilities...that is, being match fit and at 9/10 balls. So, yes it makes a significant difference.
The significant difference may be small from 8 to 9, or 7 to 8...but if a player is overplayed or underplayed at 6, 7, or 8 then the difference is much larger.
Notice my bold quote above. Form is only one of the key elements...there are many other elements involved in optimum performance...such as formations in tactics...the passing, mentality, pressing styles of your tactic...as well as, the skills of the players in the different positions and experience.
Also, it is hard to give an analysis of the above mentioned matches without knowing the makeup of the players on both sides, and styles of your tactic.
I took the liberty of challenging your senior team with my U18 squad to determine the strength of your tactic and team...the end result was a 1-1 draw. So based on that maybe you need to take a different look at your tactic and players. Just a thought.
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 06:18
dowopado wrote:Also, it is hard to give an analysis of the above mentioned matches without knowing the makeup of the players on both sides, and styles of your tactic.
Well yeah its hard for you maybe, BUT not for me. Being the NCA, i have access to their skills, which is why i said one of the teams wasnt better than mine and one of them was JUST A BIT better than mine.
and in the case of that match against the Chinese, the keeper of that team had 2 keeping, which is there for you to see too since that player was (and still is) flagged. also, some other players are flagged too, which gives u a peek into atleast 1/3rd of his team. and as is visible i DID HAVE 7 SOTs, so my question is how come none of them went in despite my 9-10 shooting strikers having tested the keeper ? (if you want i will even flag those strikers of mine for you to see).
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 06:21
dowopado wrote:I took the liberty of challenging your senior team with my U18 squad to determine the strength of your tactic and team...the end result was a 1-1 draw. So based on that maybe you need to take a different look at your tactic and players. Just a thought.
could you please send me the match report (if thats possible, given that it was a challenge match which is not visible to others) ? coz i would like to see which tactic and formation of mine u plated against. also, please send me the SOTs (of both sides) of that match too. and well, i TOO did think about that ''changing my tactics''. and that is why i spent almost 10 free challenges + almost 15+ PTs of mine challenging their teams. AND DESPITE THAT i always lost. and as i earlier mentioned, this despite their teams not being a lot better than mine (with one of the teams being weaker than mine).
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 07:13
dowopado wrote:I took the liberty of challenging your senior team with my U18 squad to determine the strength of your tactic and team...the end result was a 1-1 draw. So based on that maybe you need to take a different look at your tactic and players. Just a thought.
i have another thing to say too regarding this, but that i'll say once you reply to my above question.
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 18:13
dowopado wrote:Also challenged the Chinese team you spoke of...you can view it on my result page.
from what i see u used less better players against him compared to our match. and still he lost 7-1 while i lost 8-0 .also, its worth noting here that he's playing wings which has got an advantage over short. also, you played a 3 man defense against his wings, and not the usual 4 man which is played against wings. so his higher SOTs shouldnt really be considered here. so now, how can such a team beat me 3-0 ?
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 18:16
and given his nooby keeper, i was expecting a lot more goals than just 7. but again, the to-be-Barca keeper managed to shock me :O
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 23-03-2017 18:20
and aha i just noticed one more thing. in our match, look at my defenders lol. i dont usually play such a defence :P so with my 'normal' defence (3 man and proper positioning) i guess u can cancel out maybe like 2 to max 3 goals of yours. also, the reason i played that 'weird' defence against Sovrino was coz the challenge matches gave me a better result against his team (he has diff tactics compared to urs) than with my 3 man. thats the reason why i chose that defence. coz i used to lose only by a mragin of 3-4 against him with that (and score 1-2 too).
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 23-03-2017 19:31theloyalone wrote:from what i see u used less better players against him compared to our match. and still he lost 7-1 while i lost 8-0 .also, its worth noting here that he's playing wings which has got an advantage over short. also, you played a 3 man defense against his wings, and not the usual 4 man which is played against wings. so his higher SOTs shouldnt really be considered here. so now, how can such a team beat me 3-0 ?
Yes. I used a weaker team against the Chinese team. I tried to match up the competitions based on the age of the players. Used U21 against the Chinese team, and U23 against your team. My tactic you see is the only tactic I use for all of my Uxx competitions. At the U18 and U21 level wing tactic is not that much of an advantage because players usually don't have the skills developed yet for the specialized players needed for a wing tactic. Plus the spread tactic he uses takes at least 4 of his players out of the defense against my attacking tactic, leaves open gaps for my strikers to attack for SOTs.
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 23-03-2017 19:42theloyalone wrote:and aha i just noticed one more thing. in our match, look at my defenders lol. i dont usually play such a defence :P so with my 'normal' defence (3 man and proper positioning) i guess u can cancel out maybe like 2 to max 3 goals of yours. also, the reason i played that 'weird' defence against Sovrino was coz the challenge matches gave me a better result against his team (he has diff tactics compared to urs) than with my 3 man. thats the reason why i chose that defence. coz i used to lose only by a mragin of 3-4 against him with that (and score 1-2 too).
Maybe. You are very new to this game so you just have to be patient and do a lot of experimenting with tactics. Also, keep in mind the younger the players are the more unpredictable the results will be. U23 is usually the threshold for having some pretty decent players that can play multiple tactics and fair very well against many senior teams.
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 23-03-2017 19:48theloyalone wrote:and given his nooby keeper, i was expecting a lot more goals than just 7. but again, the to-be-Barca keeper managed to shock me :O
The keeper position is an obscured position at the younger levels because the sim has built in some superpowers for keepers for the purpose of giving the keeper an advantage over the strikers which is why sometimes a two ball keeper can seem just as strong as an 4 or 6 ball keeper.
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 24-03-2017 09:27
dowopado wrote:Maybe. You are very new to this game so you just have to be patient and do a lot of experimenting with tactics. Also, keep in mind the younger the players are the more unpredictable the results will be. U23 is usually the threshold for having some pretty decent players that can play multiple tactics and fair very well against many senior teams.
well yeah that looks to be kinda true. coz, the reason why i was so pissed about that chinese game is -
look at these 2 results -
http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&tid=1109724&mid=919210988
http://www.managerzone.com/?p=match&sub=result&tid=1109724&mid=918938127
these were 2 teams MUCH BETTER than mine (but senior teams, not U23). and i played the kinda the same tactic against both of them that i played against the chinese team. and as u can see, i lost 5-4 and 3-1 against them. and as i said, these teams were MUCH BETTER than mine as well as that chinese team. also, in the 3-1 loss,i had a much better SOT and stats, but as you see their keeper turned out to be too good for my strikers, which also lead to him get the best rating (i dont have any complaints about that, coz that keeper must have been good ofc). but the reason for my outrage against the chinese loss was DESPITE playing so well with almost the same tactic against these FAR BETTER teams, my players did SO BADLY against such a nooby team. that was my only compliant :( also, when you ACTUALLY SEE the match (in 3D). it makes u feel all the worse. watch my players against those 2 teams (which i lost 5-4 and 3-1) i felt proud and i felt 'content' that they had played in accordance to their skills. so, even though i lost, it was a very fine performance. but, when i saw the live match against the chinese (and i'll be very honest), it seemed as though my players were playing like ball-less noobs. my best defenders messed up every tackle they made, my other good (in tackling and BC) mids and defenders would easily and ALMOST EVERYTIME get tackled by 17 year olds. it was just so frustrating and outrageous to watch :$:S that was why i was actually pissed. but as u said, maybe the younger teams are very unpredictable, and so i'll try and understand the losses. but that sure doesnt mean its good to have this unpredictability which makes much better teams lose to far weaker ones :S:(:$
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Re: Form
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dowopado - 24-03-2017 16:48theloyalone wrote:i felt proud and i felt 'content' that they had played in accordance to their skills. so, even though i lost, it was a very fine performance. but, when i saw the live match against the chinese (and i'll be very honest), it seemed as though my players were playing like ball-less noobs. my best defenders messed up every tackle they made, my other good (in tackling and BC) mids and defenders would easily and ALMOST EVERYTIME get tackled by 17 year olds. it was just so frustrating and outrageous to watch
I feel your pain, as many other managers have had the same experience. I have had experiences of losing 5-1 or 6-0 against much lower teams...and it was horrible to watch because my players with 9/10 speed and stamina seemed like they had lead on their feet...and my stats were not very good.
Just had to grin and bear it because the sim is what it is. If everything was predictable, I might even get bored.;)
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Re: Form
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theloyalone - 25-03-2017 09:27
dowopado wrote:I feel your pain, as many other managers have had the same experience. I have had experiences of losing 5-1 or 6-0 against much lower teams...and it was horrible to watch because my players with 9/10 speed and stamina seemed like they had lead on their feet...and my stats were not very good.
Just had to grin and bear it because the sim is what it is. If everything was predictable, I might even get bored.;)
sorry for the late reply. was a bit busy :S:P and well, i'm glad you understand how it feels :P and i appreciate the positive attitude (Just had to grin and bear it because the sim is what it is. If everything was predictable, I might even get bored. ;) ).But you see, an 'unpredictable' game is the last thing you would want when playing a do-or-die match for group qualification (or league positions) :D;):P hahaha
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